Which is the best product to Lube a motorcycle chain

Discussion in 'Motorbike Technical Discussion' started by Gixxerman, Apr 18, 2007.

  1. No, we have friends in NM, and we've been over there a couple of times,
    but that's all.

    Very interesting. Makes you think about values, etc.

    I don't give a stuff about cars as a status symbol, but lots and lots of
    people do. I'm interested in some c ars from an engineering and visceral
    POV, but that's it. On our overcrowded island there are not many places
    where one can use one properly. Certainly not in in the SE and London,
    where I live.

    I suppose one very British fixation is houses and mortgages. We have an
    *incredibly* high percentage of owner/occupiers, certanly compared with
    other European countries. Everyone's dream is to have their own house,
    and a helluva lot of people do.

    Again, because land is scarce and therefore expensive (especially,
    again, in London and the SE), this takes up a *major* part of one's
    salary.

    I mean, if I told you I lived in a house that's worth $750,000-800,000
    you might get the impression I'm wealthy. But I'm not. That's the
    cumination of 25 years of mortgages anbd moving up from a flat as a
    starter home. And it's the price of living in suburban London.

    If I told you I lived in a house with three double bedrooms, one single
    bedroom, and a single bathroom (downstairs loo, though) you might think
    I live in a relatively poor style. And you'd be right. That's what you
    get for your 800 grand (dollars).

    So life-enhancement, for us anyway, doesn't come from material
    possessions because (with two teenage kids and the mortgage) we don't
    actually have that much disposable income. But decent holidays, freinds,
    and simple things like nice evenings in pubs (and motorcycles, lots of
    them) go a long, long way.

    TV? Don't wacth it much. Maybe a couple of hours a night. None of the
    family watches breakfast TV.
     
    The Older Gentleman, Apr 22, 2007
    #61
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  2. Gixxerman

    Roger Hunt Guest

    The Older Gentleman wrote
    They might consider getting up before lunchtime then.
    (runs away)
     
    Roger Hunt, Apr 22, 2007
    #62
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  3. Gixxerman

    John Johnson Guest

    Look, I know that came off as a bit assinine, but it's not meant to be.
    You'll notice also that I never advanced any specific theory about what
    causes your red tides or algal blooms. I never claimed that they are the
    result of runoff. I only said that I trust the professionals
    determinations. If they say that SoCal's problems are in part, or in
    their entirety, caused by farm runoff, it's them you need to argue with
    and not me. And the reason I brought up evidence, when I plainly have
    none at all, is that the professionals typically do have such evidence,
    and lots of it. Some of it is even publicly accessible.

    As for farming relations, I've got a family full of them myself, and out
    here there's plenty of farmers who fertilize every year, and it's a rare
    summer that's without rain, and there's a lot of feedlot operations,
    etc. Maybe the primary source of those nitrates and phosphates varies
    with geography, major crops, soil type, and other factors?

    Well, we should look it up, read the research, educate ourselves and
    discuss the evidence. But nobody on a motorcycle newsgroup really wants
    to read this stuff, and I don't really want to research it when I come
    here for motorcycle discussion. I stand by my original claims: if
    professionals say that the problem ini the SF bay is farm runoff, I'll
    believe them until someone shows me reason to believe otherwise. If they
    don't, same deal. In the meantime, I DON'T KNOW WHAT CAUSES THEM.




    For those who care, I spent 30 minutes looking stuff up. It's
    interesting, but there's nothing here about motorcycles.


    A quick look via google brings up a number of pages that imply that
    nitrate runoff might be more serious in corn-growing regions (my
    understanding is that California doesn't grow a whole lot of corn, but I
    might be wrong). In particular, this map of runoff:

    http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20040612/bob9.asp

    While it only shows the mississippi river drainage basin (and I haven't
    checked the USGS for maps that are more comprehensive, sorry), it's
    pretty clear that nitrogen content of commercial fertilizer is highest
    in the grain belt, and tails off as one moves outside of it. A number of
    other sites give information that implies that corn is a crop that
    demands nitrogen-rich soil while other crops do not.

    On to red tides:

    http://sfbay.wr.usgs.gov/publications/pdf/cloern_2005_red_tide.pdf

    This article DOES NOT CLAIM ANY PARTICULAR SOURCE OF NUTRIENTS FOR THE
    RED TIDE. Pay attention to that, it's important.

    Now then, it does say that the SF bay is nutrient rich (for whatever
    reason), and goes on to discuss some things that make red tides happen
    there, in particular:
    -temperatures must be high enough
    -water turbulence must subside enough

    (for some value of "enough")

    Now, I'm going to speculate a bit, if you'll allow me, to demonstrate
    why "red tides happen in summer, it can't be runoff" isn't a safe
    statement to make without evidence: In this article, the water was
    already nutrient-rich, and the red tide only occurred when the
    temperature raised enough, and the mixing of the bay waters subsided
    enough, to provide a good environment for the microorganisms. It's
    entirely possible, given these factors, that the runoff could have
    occurred months earlier, and the red tide was prevented by lower
    temperatures, etc.

    OR, it's entirely possible that the same mixing mechanisms remove
    nutrients from the bay fairly quickly, so that spring runoff cannot
    provide the nutrients for a summer red tide.

    Two completely plausible options, and I can't choose between them
    because I don't know how the bay works. OTOH, at least one of those
    options means re-thinking your claim that no summer rain means no farm
    runoff means no farm runoff-caused red tides, because those nutrients
    MIGHT just sit there.

    There's also evidence that the situation is far more complex than we've
    so far been discussing:

    http://plankt.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/16/9/1269

    In the abstract (no, I didn't read the entire article) we see some
    factors listed for causing a red tide in the early 1990s in SF Bay.
    Among those factors we find this: "depletions of dissolved inorganic N
    and Si in the photic zone;" So, depletion of nitrates, when common
    sense would make one think that we'd need _extra_ nitrates (well, except
    for the fact that those nitrates don't have to be in the photic zone,
    because the dinoflagellates apparently move deeper during the night to
    feed and move back up during the day to photosynthesize).

    I could go on, but nobody's reading.

    --
    Later,
    John



    'indiana' is a 'nolnn' and 'hoosier' is a 'solkk'. Indiana doesn't solkk.
     
    John Johnson, Apr 22, 2007
    #63
  4. Gixxerman

    Timo Geusch Guest

    If you've ever seen what's on British breakfast TV, you'll understand
    why it's a good thing to get up late.
     
    Timo Geusch, Apr 22, 2007
    #64
  5. Gixxerman

    Roger Hunt Guest

    Timo Geusch wrote
    I bet it's absolute rubbish.
     
    Roger Hunt, Apr 22, 2007
    #65
  6. Gixxerman

    Albrecht Guest

    Maybe you could find a newsgroup that discusses pollution and
    environmental issues?

    Maybe you could exhibit the restraint necessary to refrain from
    responding to the trolls in this group?
    Yabbot, you get SO bored reading the same responses to the same
    problems over and over and over, and you just feel compelled to post
    *something* after reading the repetitive responses. You also want the
    helpful people to just shut up and go away because their answers bore
    you.

    You want new stimulation, so you grab onto whatever fresh idea floats
    by. And the trolls love to play "courtroom", but "The People's Court"
    is not interactive, so you'll take what you can get.

    But "winning" one of these long-running debates offers such transient
    satisfaction, you always must return for more pointless argument.

    When are you going to wake up to the ringing of the bell? This pig is
    dead.




    FIT VI.--THE BARRISTER'S DREAM.

    Fit the Sixth.

    THE BARRISTER'S DREAM.

    They sought it with thimbles, they sought it with care;
    They pursued it with forks and hope;
    They threatened its life with a railway-share;
    They charmed it with smiles and soap.

    But the Barrister, weary of proving in vain
    That the Beaver's lace-making was wrong,
    Fell asleep, and in dreams saw the creature quite plain
    That his fancy had dwelt on so long.

    He dreamed that he stood in a shadowy Court,
    Where the Snark, with a glass in its eye,
    Dressed in gown, bands, and wig, was defending a pig
    On the charge of deserting its sty.

    The Witnesses proved, without error or flaw,
    That the sty was deserted when found:
    And the Judge kept explaining the state of the law
    In a soft under-current of sound.

    The indictment had never been clearly expressed,
    And it seemed that the Snark had begun,
    And had spoken three hours, before any one guessed
    What the pig was supposed to have done.

    The Jury had each formed a different view
    (Long before the indictment was read),
    And they all spoke at once, so that none of them knew
    One word that the others had said.

    "You must know ---" said the Judge: but the Snark exclaimed "Fudge!"
    That statute is obsolete quite!
    Let me tell you, my friends, the whole question depends
    On an ancient manorial right.

    "In the matter of Treason the pig would appear
    To have aided, but scarcely abetted:
    While the charge of Insolvency fails, it is clear,
    If you grant the plea 'never indebted.'

    "The fact of Desertion I will not dispute;
    But its guilt, as I trust, is removed
    (So far as relates to the costs of this suit)
    By the Alibi which has been proved.

    "My poor client's fate now depends on your votes."
    Here the speaker sat down in his place,
    And directed the Judge to refer to his notes
    And briefly to sum up the case.

    But the Judge said he never had summed up before;
    So the Snark undertook it instead,
    And summed it so well that it came to far more
    Than the Witnesses ever had said!

    When the verdict was called for, the Jury declined,
    As the word was so puzzling to spell;
    But they ventured to hope that the Snark wouldn't mind
    Undertaking that duty as well.

    So the Snark found the verdict, although, as it owned,
    It was spent with the toils of the day:
    When it said the word "GUILTY!" the Jury all groaned,
    And some of them fainted away.

    Then the Snark pronounced sentence, the Judge being quite
    Too nervous to utter a word:
    When it rose to its feet, there was silence like night,
    And the fall of a pin might be heard.

    "Transportation for life" was the sentence it gave,
    "And then to be fined forty pound."
    The Jury all cheered, though the Judge said he feared
    That the phrase was not legally sound.

    But their wild exultation was suddenly checked
    When the jailer informed them, with tears,
    Such a sentence would have not the slightest effect,
    As the pig had been dead for some years.

    The Judge left the Court, looking deeply disgusted:
    But the Snark, though a little aghast,
    As the lawyer to whom the defence was intrusted,
    Went bellowing on to the last.

    Thus the Barrister dreamed, while the bellowing seemed
    To grow every moment more clear:
    Till he woke to the knell of a furious bell,
    Which the Bellman rang close at his ear.

    ----Lewis Carroll, "The Hunting of the Snark"
     
    Albrecht, Apr 22, 2007
    #66
  7. Gixxerman

    Timo Geusch Guest

    So I guess you're not one for getting up early either then?
     
    Timo Geusch, Apr 22, 2007
    #67

  8. No idea.
     
    The Older Gentleman, Apr 22, 2007
    #68
  9. Gixxerman

    Roger Hunt Guest

    Timo Geusch wrote
    I wouldn't need to get out of bed ...
     
    Roger Hunt, Apr 22, 2007
    #69
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