The End

This post makes me so angry on so may levels that I'm going to kill
the thread before I have to kill someone.

--
Nigel - Manufacturer of the "Champion-105" range of rearsets

WS* GHPOTHUF#24 APOSTLE#14 DLC#1 COFF#20 BOTAFOT#150 HYPO#0(KoTL) IbW#41
ZZR1100, Enfield 500 Curry House Racer "The Basmati Rice Burner",
Honda GL1000K2 Kawasaki ZN1300 Voyager "Oh, Oh, It's so big"

 

Nigel Eaton wrote

Name three.

 

I admire a man with ambition.

 

FFS Mark, it isn't supposed to be "Income", it's supposed to be an
allowance to help people whilst they find a job.

No, see my comment above.

Nor do I, give them JSA for 12 months, then unless they have medical,
childcare, or other oficially recognised justification for not working
they attend compulsary retraining or lose their benefits.

I mean, FFS, work exists. Almost every time I go out I spot "Staff
wanted" signs in the window of shops, now it's basic, sure, but still
the pay is better than the JSA and people have to at least do something
for it encouraging them to get up off their arses and contribute back to
the coffers for hospitals, schools, etc.

A better solution than people living of the taxes of those who can be
bothered to work IMHO.

 

Well exactly. I didn't put it very well, that's a fair cop, but what I
mean is, I want to try a job out for a few weeks and not have to go
through a lot of BS to say I've done it. I think it would be a lot
fairer to let someone work for, say a month, see if they like the
job/the job likes them and then work out whether any extra benefits
apply[1]

Couldn't agree more. I think this is what they do anyway isn't it? I was
listening to someone moaning about "having to go to a job interview". I
mean FFS, even if you're only a few quid better off, the difference in
the way you feel and about life in general is worth it IMHO.

Ditto.

Bung 'em on a volcanic island somewhere and send restaurant wastage by
boat every two weeks and let 'em fight amongst themselves for the
scraps.

[1] I'd have to be earning IRO £17,000 just to break even. That pays for
my rent, council tax, utilities and food. If I'm lucky, I might just
squeak £50 a week to waste on whatever took my fancy but that's it.
Break even.

 

Why?

 

I never had you down as a member of the Republican or Democratic party.
You should stand in the presidential elections alongside the Bushbaby
and that knackered old Vietnam veteran.

There was a feature on the news about what happens to Americans when
they no longer have any state support of *any* kind. I can assure you
they don't all leap to their feet to find work - simply because there
isn't any to find. I find it immoral that a society can condemn its
weakest and most needy to a life of living in the gutter despite the
obscene amount of wealth created in that same society.

 

He's probably just grumpy because rush don't love him.

 

I'm neither, what I'm against is career spongers. You know they exist
as well as I do.

Interesting point that. Even when there is nobody hiring, that is not
the same as work not existing IMHO. People could start up for
themselves, the rich will always need their gardens maintaining, the
windows cleaning... people in the industrial estate may well want
sandwiches for lunch. Then there's the Cane route, make something, find
people that want it, grow a business doing something other people don't,
it may not be easy, but life isn't supposed to be. Benefits should be a
safety net to allow people to get up, dust off and start again; benefits
should not be a career move.

Me too, the cure to that in my opinion is more support for small local
business, more cooperatives, more communities supporting themselves, and
more of us becoming involved.

It's something we can all affect, wherever we fit in society and however
we earn a crust. Use the local shop, the local trades people, think
twice about using the big chains and the mega corporations when there's
a workable alternative. At the same time freely take the money from
those with obscene wealth, spend it wisely. It's a redistribution thing.

Now look what you've done Paul, I never thought I'd sound like such a
tree hugger.

 

Not that easy, when you figure in the council tax benefit, housing
benefit, free medical, dental and optical.

Take those away, then add on the cost of getting to work and it isn't
quite so easy.

Despite that, I agree with you - get the buggers working instead of
turning my taxes into ciggy smoke!
--

Cheers!
Fr Jack
96 Tiger.
FRJACK AT GMAIL DOT COM

 

Thatcherite scum.

 

You're a bright bloke, Rob, but you don't know very much. Which is
why you continue to say things like this.

 

Couldn't have put it better myself.

 

Never voted for the woman, but I did grow up with her as a backdrop to
politics. I've always taken the approach there is no safety net and
I'll have to look after myself if things go wrong. I'm sure at some
point it'll happen too, then I'll find out.

 

So, provide me with some justification as to why people who could work
and support themselves should be supported not to, at the expense of the
taxpayer?

 

Going into partnership with sirtony, eh?

I haven't yet worked out whether this is a Billy Big-Balls situation,
or that you've bottled it and scarpered. However, you've made a
decision and that seems to have made you happier. I suppose you can
always go back to couriering if you feel the need for a good whinge
any time.

Good luck, fella.

 

And you'll manage. But don't make the mistake of assuming that
because you could survive, everyone can.

 

The problem with everybody being an entrepreneur is that not everbody's
entrepreneur material. There are a lot of jobs where that simply isn't a
practical model, but they're still essential jobs: minimum-wage checkout
girl, for example. Is she going to be a self-employed subcontractor? Will
she be able to afford an accountant? Will she be a hard-hearted soldier of
fortune, living out of a suitcase, travelling from one job to the next -
Sainsbury in Gloucester one week, Safeway in Grimsby the next, jetting out
to put in a weekend in an Auchan in Clermont-Ferrand, her mobile constantly
ringing with calls from agents? Well, she could be, but she wouldn't get
out of bed for less than £50 an hour, and what would that do to the price of
your shopping?

There were a lot of people pushed into self-employed status inappropriately,
and many of them ended up (and are still ending up) bankrupt. Sarah had a
run of self-employed chicken-catchers the other year. Nobody likes
paperwork, and many people can't cope with it at all. If they suddenly find
themselves having to deal with tax, VAT, national insurance, pensions etc,
it simply isn't going to work. And do you think the Inland Revenue would
prefer to deal with the trained professional finance staff of a large
employer, or a couple of thousand one-man-army operations who haven't a
fucking clue what they're doing, but think they have to negotiate hard to
ensure they don't get tucked up?

And while I'm off on one, what about privatisation? The plan seemed to be:
sell off the nation's infrastructure to fund election-winning scams, and the
new owners will provide a better service for less money /and/ pay a dividend
to the shareholders. Yeah, that'll work.

Grrr.

 

Can I just say...

<AOL>

--
Alex
BMW R1150GS
DIAABTCOD#3 MSWF#4 UKRMFBC#6 Ibw#35 BOB#8
http://www.team-ukrm.co.uk
Windy's "little soldier"

 

Ahh grrr eee with most of that. I started up a one man ltd company a year
and a bit ago and am struggling to cope with the paperwork as well as
being ready to be called out at anytime to troubleshoot networks. Plenty
of work to do but the Inland revenue, Customs and excise and NI are about
to crucify me for being late with the returns. Too many distractions/not
enough time or inclination.

Still, it's better than being made redundant I suppose.

I used to own a bit of British Gas, British Rail, British Steel and the
telephone system. Then they offered to sell my own bit back to me at an
inflated price so some twats could get their gardens tended by the
disenfranchised.

Double Grrrrrrrrrrrr