Sports tourer market in Aus?

Been thinking about upgrading to a larger sportier bike from the
CB250.

Decided I wanted something faired, very low vibration (not a v-twin)
and not peaky in its power delivery. a nice sexy looking tourer able
to comfily do longer trips. less than 1000cc but still good cornering.

Anyway this post isnt about my particular choice but how the aussie
market supplies that demand.

Aside from the Kwak ZZR600 and a suzuki 750 (that I cant remember the
name of) theres very little out there which meets this criteria. Lots
and lots of v-twins and insane 1000cc bikes though.

The honda salesperson basically said that due to bikes being more of a
luxury item here than OS (europe) people tend to buy the more
specifically designed extreme variants such as the ZX-6RR and CBR600RR
which are less practical away from the track. He believes that there
is very little demand for a crossover style sports/tourer. people
either get an insane sports or a long distance cruiser (VT-750)
instead .

I find this funny considering the cage world is more and more going
the other way with crossover 4wd/sports/lifestyle cars like X-trails,
Forester turbos, porsche cayennes gaining in popularity. maybe cars
are more of a necessity.

btw, I'll probably go the zzr600

 

In aus.motorcycles on 15 Aug 2004 20:50:38 -0700

VF750 - V4?

Zebee

 

I dunno. There is a fair few of them out there, but, because of the long
distances we tend to travel here if we are going the sports-tourer route,
they tend to be the big-bore alternatives. (ZZR1200, ZRX1200S, FJR1300,
HireBus, SuperBudgie, K1200RS, R1150RT, etc etc etc). (Queue large
quantities of posts about how I forgot this that or the other.)

Smaller ones are out there, though. And being a twin doesn't necessarily
make them really bad vibration wise.

Look at Honda Deauville (it looks gay, is slow enough to be learner legal,
but it will tour in comfort), Honda VFR800, Ducati ST3, Kwaka ZZR600, Suzuki
GSXF750, etc etc. (Queue even more posts about how I forgot this that or the
other.)

I personally have found my ZX10 to be a great all-rounder bike. Lots of
power for playing nutty bastards, enough torque to have fun without doing
the left-footed dance, handles well enough to be fun and quick on the road,
can cruise all day comfortably (relatively speaking - it's no goldwing), is
pretty easy to fit luggage to (aftermarket rack (don't let me get started),
throw over panniers, tank bag), and I could go on, but you get the gist.

As for cars, most of the "cross-over" things are targetted at people who
want either the additional carrying capacity, or the "soccer mum" safety
factor. (It's big and there's lots of metal, so it'll be safer!) Most of
them you wouldn't dare to take more off road than you'd take a "normal" car
(eg: Camry). The cross-over cars (sports 4wds) to me appear to be for the
people who really need a large car (to take the kids) but would really like
it to be a sports car. (Ferrari don't make a people mover yet).

Just MHO.

BTW, I think the ZZR-600 is a good choice too (although the oil filter is a
_bastard_ to get at).

 

Gee Zebee. The VF750 has been available new for _ages_!!!

 

VFR750/800 is a lot better bike than ZZR600, does everything you say
you want and more. Only problem is finding your one among the
millions of others at every place bike riders gather. I'm amazed
the Honda salesperson didn't mention this option. If I had my choice
of VFR's it'd be the first-shape 800 without VTEC.

 

1. faired,
2. very low vibration (not a v-twin)
3. and not peaky in its power delivery.
4. a nice sexy looking tourer
5. able to comfily do longer trips.
6. less than 1000cc but
7. still good cornering.

You've specified 7 points which your bike must meet. It's no wonder thatthe
list of bikes which meet all of your criteria is very short. You can't always
have what you want, so you have to prioritise your list and concede a fewof
the lower ranked items.
Remove #6 and there are plenty of 1000cc+ bikes which meet all other criteria,
but coming off a 250cc you might not want to.
Not even considering any v-twin bikes without riding them to see whether they
really are "high vibration" is probably a flaw in your logic. Is a 90°V-Twin
more or less vibey than a 270° inline twin?
If you find a bike which meets all but point 4... get lots of brochures and
posters of this bike and leave them lying around the house... it might grow on
you after a few weeks.
How comfortable a bike is on long trips is quite subjective and will differ
from person to person. You might find that an otherwise uncomfortable bike
becomes quite a good tourer with a few hundred dollars spent on after market
handlebars, or a new seat, or a sheepskin cover etc. Non-bike related mods
like wearing comfortable riding gear, a kidney belt/back protector and a
camelbak or similar hydrapack will all go a long way to adding rider comfort
and endurance.

Nev..
'03 ZX12R

 

Also, number 7 is very subjective too.

What is "good cornering".

From what I've read, the K1200LT corners very well for something of it's
size, but it's never going to have the same sort of corner speed as a 125GP
bike.

Coming of a CB250 though, lots of things will corner as well as a CB250 -
while they're a great learner bike, they aren't exactly the _best_ handling
bikes.

Also, why exactly do you want less than 1000cc? I can see 2 real
possibilities: 1 is that you've been told by someone putting up the readies
(read parents) that you can't have a 1000cc bike, and the other is that you
are afraid of the amount of power in a 1000cc bike.

If the second one is the case (and there's no shame in admitting it - you
should be coming off a 250 - I kinda wish I hadn't hopped straight onto a
1000cc bike off my Ps (or not even off them as the case may have been).
Might have held on to my license for a bit longer. (Have it back now, and
ride a lot slower on the road).

But, if it is the power, consider something "big" but a little more detuned.
An R1150RT isn't exactly in the same league power wise as an
ABC1000ArrArrArr. It's over 1000cc, but it's not a big "top end" engine.

Also, another question is How much fairing? Do you want Fully Faired (eg
ZZR600) or would you be happy with something to keep the wind/bugs off your
chest, without covering up all the worky bits of the bike (eg Fazer600)

--
James Mayfield
"Insert witty comment here."

1. faired,
2. very low vibration (not a v-twin)
3. and not peaky in its power delivery.
4. a nice sexy looking tourer
5. able to comfily do longer trips.
6. less than 1000cc but
7. still good cornering.

You've specified 7 points which your bike must meet. It's no wonder that
the
list of bikes which meet all of your criteria is very short. You can't
always
have what you want, so you have to prioritise your list and concede a few of
the lower ranked items.
Remove #6 and there are plenty of 1000cc+ bikes which meet all other
criteria,
but coming off a 250cc you might not want to.
Not even considering any v-twin bikes without riding them to see whether
they
really are "high vibration" is probably a flaw in your logic. Is a 90°
V-Twin
more or less vibey than a 270° inline twin?
If you find a bike which meets all but point 4... get lots of brochures and
posters of this bike and leave them lying around the house... it might grow
on
you after a few weeks.
How comfortable a bike is on long trips is quite subjective and will differ
from person to person. You might find that an otherwise uncomfortable bike
becomes quite a good tourer with a few hundred dollars spent on after market
handlebars, or a new seat, or a sheepskin cover etc. Non-bike related mods
like wearing comfortable riding gear, a kidney belt/back protector and a
camelbak or similar hydrapack will all go a long way to adding rider comfort
and endurance.

Nev..
'03 ZX12R

 

Dave,

Like a couple of other responses, I suggest you should consider one of the
VFR750/pre vtec VFR800 bikes.

Having said which, I owned a ZZ-R600 for some time and it was a fine bike. I
now own a VFR800 for what that's worth.

Mike

 

and 4 rules out VFR's


--
smack

people say I know **** nothing........

4. a nice sexy looking tourer
5. able to comfily do longer trips.
6. less than 1000cc but
7. still good cornering.

 

Get a K1200RS, and disconnect one spark plug lead.

Voila, everything you want, in a 900 cc bike.

David

 

Having recently bought a zz-r 600 I have found it a great little bike
(particularly if you're a shorty like me). Good compromise of power, handing
and comfort. I ride it to work each day and take the odd weekend trip
(anything up to 1000 km's) and never have I felt it uncomfortable or lacking
in power or handling.


Krazykol
ZZR 600

 

A couple of people have specifically mentioned the pre VTEC VFR, why is
that?

Steve
ZZR250
(will also be looking at the sports tourer market in about a years time)

 

The Suzuki you're talking about is the GSXF, surprised no one else jumped in
on that one.

A 98 VFR800 will do all that you specify there, although they're a bit on
the dull side. Duller still, you can look at the 650 Honda Deauville. Dull
as dog shit, but if you find the ZZR600 a "nice sexy looking tourer" ymmv.
You could check out the Beemers too, but they're a bit bigger.

Don't forget also that adventure tourers are becoming more popular for long
distance stuff. There are still a few examples of the large tourers around
too (FJRs, STs) so I don't think its all just sporties and cruisers.

--
Cheers
Dave (Mojo67)
FZR600 >> ZX6R >> ??? Brisbane
http://users.bigpond.net.au/mojo67/mojo67.htm
I used to never be able to finish anything but now I

 

A couple of people have specifically mentioned the pre VTEC VFR, why is

Because the VTEC VFR's are (a) ugly and (b) have VTEC. Whereas
the non-VTEC ones look great and have great power all through the rev
range without the mechanical trickery (and expense?) involved with
VTEC.

 

I haven't ridden one but they reportedly have a significant power band that
can come in at awkward moments.

--
Cheers
Dave (Mojo67)
FZR600 >> ZX6R >> ??? Brisbane
http://users.bigpond.net.au/mojo67/mojo67.htm
I used to never be able to finish anything but now I

 

Rubbish.


http://yellowbike.mediacrop.net/

 

not a very good photoshop of the dog sitting on the bike.
Either that or the seat is so soft it's paw has sunk in.

 

Hi Mike- Please help me find out / understand the problems with the VTEC
versions. Any links? or could you help me understand.
Martin
============================

 

Thanks everyone for the replies, lots of good points to consider.

I admit it, I dont feel comfortable going staight to a 1000+cc bike. I
know I'm not the best rider in the world and sometimes I find the CB a
handful to punt nicely around corners at speed. But I rode the girls
ZZR250 the other day and was amazed at how much easier it is to
corner, brake and generally control than the more upright CB250.

The whole vibration thing is really important to me. The CB really
gets a lot of vibration up when ridden fast for 5-6 hours. I'm tired
of my right wrist/carpal area being sore for days after a ride. Her
ZZR250 seemed to have a lot less vibaration. Something about the
smaller capacity sub 1000cc 4cyl engines reassures me that they will
be smoother...?

The fairing is important, whilst I like the naked look, its not much
fun highway riding in winter sitting straight up into the wind and
getting all the cold air rushing up the (low) tank into your crotch

After I stopped raving about her ZZR250, she said a good point: I
would probably ride more often if I didnt have to deal with all the
compromises the CB presents to me.

When I finally get the time and $$$, I will be definatly looking at
all the bikes people have suggested here.

 

The time and cost of the major service is apparently hideous, and if it
isn't, then its probably not getting done right. The last of the 750's and
the first of the 800's seem to be the common choice.