Paging the internet security-isti

Discussion in 'UK Motorcycles' started by TOG@Toil, Nov 19, 2009.

  1. TOG@Toil

    Higgins Guest

    Can I claim a whoosh?
     
    Higgins, Nov 19, 2009
    #21
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  2. TOG@Toil

    Higgins Guest

    RAS syndrome, apparently :)
     
    Higgins, Nov 19, 2009
    #22
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  3. TOG@Toil

    YTC#1 Guest

    And, how did they get to the person that hands it out ?

    I bet they are not printed on site.
     
    YTC#1, Nov 19, 2009
    #23
  4. TOG@Toil

    ginge Guest

    Mine's been electronic for about 2 years and I get emailed a PDF once
    a month. I just keep the emails archived in their own folder within
    my email archive.

    I can't see how they could easily enforce what you do with them, and
    suspect the reason they don't want them saved on local machines is so
    one member of staff doesn't see somebody elses payslip due to a
    careless mistake on a shared machine.

    If you're concerned save them on a password protected USB key or
    similar.
     
    ginge, Nov 19, 2009
    #24
  5. TOG@Toil

    ginge Guest

    Are you aware you're channeling today's Dilbert?

    http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2009-11-19/
     
    ginge, Nov 19, 2009
    #25
  6. TOG@Toil

    Pip Luscher Guest

    I think the implication was that companies don't want their
    lesser-paid employees to discover that the lazy wanker at the next
    desk is earning 50% more than they are.
     
    Pip Luscher, Nov 19, 2009
    #26
  7. TOG@Toil

    Sean_Q_ Guest

    TOG I think you might like this story. The company I once worked for
    changed from paper paychecks (pay packets?) to automated bank account
    deposits every two weeks.

    One day I went to the bank and found a month's worth of pay deposited
    by machine. That didn't seem right. So I withdrew it all in cash to see
    what would happen. In the short term, nothing did. Then next day
    there was another 2 weeks worth in my account. I withdrew that all that
    in cash, too, leaving only a few dollars.

    Soon after that I heard there'd been a big mixup between the bank
    and my company's payroll department. Each side blamed the other.

    Most of the employees found out after the fact that the spurious
    month's pay had been deposited and then removed from their accounts
    the next day. But not mine of course; I had the extra money in my
    piggy bank.

    Well contrary to what I see on TV, no SWAT team rappelled down from
    helicopters to surround my house with assault rifles with a cop
    (or plod) on a bullhorn ordering me to come out with my hands where
    they could see them. In fact nobody seemed concerned in the least.

    However I did have the vague notion that sooner or later the jig
    would be up. Ie the longer I held on to the money the more likely
    I would appear to a criminal court to have _mens rea_ (guilty intent).

    So I went to see the payroll accountant and told him what happened.
    He got a good laugh (apparently at the bank's expense). Then he said
    I'd better give it back or I could get busted for "theft by conversion",
    whatever that was. I asked how could I be guilty of a crime that
    I'd never even heard of? He had another laugh, this time with a tone
    that made me nervous.

    It gets better.

    Ok, so *who* do I give the money back to, I asked. The bank, he said.

    So I went to my bank, told the Customer Service girl what happened
    and plopped the money down on her counter in cash. She wouldn't
    accept it! Said I owed it to my employer, not them. Next, please.

    Shee-it, now I was out on a legal limb with no way back to the tree!
    Wait a minit, sez I, if that's the way things are I want it in writing,
    with your signature on it.

    She turned a whiter shade of pale, and called for backup. Some
    important looking bloke with an important looking business suit
    emerged from a grotto saying importantly, what's all this about, then?

    I explained again. He got an annoyed expression, like I'd just
    dumped an awkward, tedious problem in his lap. I've never seen
    a bank (or any other outfit) so reluctant to accept money!
    One of his problems was that the bank had no standard forms,
    either on paper or the computer, to cover this situation.

    Finally I said if he wouldn't take the money I'd go down to
    the local Cop Shop, mention his name and give THEM the cash.
    After all, I had to cover my ass somehow.

    There was a phone call to someone higher up in the ethereal
    echelons, as it says in _Catch-22_ which I beginning to feel
    like a character in. Finally with something less than good grace
    he took the cash and gave me a typed-up receipt.

    I'm not a financial type, so I don't know whose books wouldn't
    have balanced eventually; my employer's, their bank, my bank,
    some Clearing House or whatever. The poor guy, I must have ruined
    his afternoon; he probably spent it trying to sort the whole
    mess out.

    SQ
     
    Sean_Q_, Nov 19, 2009
    #27
  8. TOG@Toil

    geoff Guest

    You should have gone to the police, told them that you found this money
    in your bank account, then returned a month later to ask if it had been
    claimed ... then claimed possession
     
    geoff, Nov 19, 2009
    #28
  9. TOG@Toil

    ginge Guest

    Sure it is, but there's the possibility that doing so would cause your
    employer issues if somebody (or several people) earning less found out
    and made a fuss.

    And that may mean your employer wouldn't want it happening, so despite
    it being unenforceable, could state a policy.
     
    ginge, Nov 19, 2009
    #29
  10. TOG@Toil

    Sean_Q_ Guest

    You could be right. However, our benighted Canadian education system
    didn't instruct us on how to handle every possible situation.

    Apparently, the UK schools don't, either. For instance some poor bloke
    recently found a shotgun in his garden. Trying to act like good citizen,
    he took it to the police station to turn it in... and was promptly
    arrested and charged with a serious firearms offense -- and he's looking
    at 5 years in Wormwood Scrubbs, minimum.

    I can only hope the British justice system eventually comes to
    their senses and starts to act reasonably in this case.

    http://www.thisissurreytoday.co.uk/...nding-gun/article-1509082-detail/article.html

    SQ
     
    Sean_Q_, Nov 20, 2009
    #30
  11. TOG@Toil

    geoff Guest

    Or common sense solutions ?
    Maybe you should read the thread on this, it appears that there might be
    more to this than meets the eye
     
    geoff, Nov 20, 2009
    #31
  12. TOG@Toil

    Andy Bonwick Guest

    One of our directors (1) has to ask me my rates every year because the
    others don't tell him.

    (1) You've met John, he's a bit 'special'.
     
    Andy Bonwick, Nov 20, 2009
    #32
  13. TOG@Toil

    Cab Guest

    What if the payslips are electronically signed?
     
    Cab, Nov 20, 2009
    #33
  14. TOG@Toil

    CT Guest

    No company I've ever worked out has said to me:
    "Now, once a month we'll give you a payslip in an envelope. We have a
    policy that it must not be opened and left unattended on your desk in
    case someone else see it, as it might cause us 'issues'."

    I don't see what the physical medium has to do with it.
     
    CT, Nov 20, 2009
    #34
  15. TOG@Toil

    Lady Nina Guest

    Hang on, I'm writing a report which highlights how certain areas of
    Canada are in the top league of education in the world. Boss is over
    there atm at a conference which is being used as a first run for the
    results of our two year project before it has its launch here in
    March. Which bit are you in and when were you last in the education
    system?
     
    Lady Nina, Nov 20, 2009
    #35
  16. TOG@Toil

    YTC#1 Guest

    Dunno, don't care :p
     
    YTC#1, Nov 20, 2009
    #36
  17. TOG@Toil

    YTC#1 Guest


    In which case you have not put much thought into what will be kept,
    where and how that info could save your life.

    When you, for what ever reason, are taken into a hospital 100s of miles
    from home, unconscious, and they make a request for allergy info that
    takes 3 days to arrive instead of a couple of mins, your possible death
    may have been avoided.

    Just a small use for a connected system that makes sense.
     
    YTC#1, Nov 20, 2009
    #37
  18. TOG@Toil

    TOG@Toil Guest

    I don't mind how the payslips and their info are communicated to us as
    employees. What worries me is the insistence that the only way to keep
    a payroll record (with all its sensitive data such as NI number)
    henceforth is on your personal PC. Not a work PC, behind a corporate
    firewall, but on a rather more vulnerable device.

    OK, so sending payroll slips through the post has its risks, as does
    emailing them, but in this instance a whole new security risk has
    deliberately been opened up where it didn't exist before.

    Oh, and to make things better we've just been told that the slips can
    *only* be viewed on a Windoze PC and *only* in IE7, so us Mac bods
    (and those who choose to use Firefox, Chrome, Opera or indeed anything
    other than IE) are stuffed.

    Well, no worries. I'll demand a paper slip, as ever.
     
    TOG@Toil, Nov 20, 2009
    #38
  19. TOG@Toil

    Colin Irvine Guest

    It's the only use I've ever heard used to justify it. I don't have any
    allergies. Are there any other uses?
     
    Colin Irvine, Nov 20, 2009
    #39
  20. TOG@Toil

    B 650 Guest

    TOG@Toil wrote:
    There's this generally held belief that corporate networks are far more
    secure than home networks. My work is server security, and I'm
    regularly faced with the "but it's on our internal LAN, behind the
    firewalls, so it is secure" argument. I point out that there are best
    part of 100,000 people who have access to that network so, no, it is
    *not* secure.

    Your home network will likely have a small handful of people on it, who
    you would sincerely hope do not have any malicious intent with your
    personal data. Your work network will have many more people who have
    more motivation to access your payslip and use it for a purpose for
    which it was not intended.

    Internet nastiness is internal as well as external
     
    B 650, Nov 20, 2009
    #40
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