OT.. Knee Jerk Reaction

Baker and company released the Iraq report that has been underway for the
past
eight months.. First impressions were that these people had responsibly
studied
our position in Iraq and come to conclusions that would be helpful in
resolving
that issue..

Several of our elected representatives asked probing questions about the
report
when Baker and Hamilton appeared before their committee.. I kept waiting..
and
I'm still waiting..

To date.. there is no mention of Saudi Arabia, either in the report or in
the questions
asked.. None at all.. There is quite a few references to Syria and Iran..
their involve-
ment and responsibility.. and, the possible roles they could play in
resolution of the
Iraq situation.. It has been established that both Iran and Syria have
financially
supported the Shia's and provided them with weapons, in their campaigns
against the
Sunnis'. That is pretty well common knowledge.. did it take a blue ribbon
panel of
Americas' finest.. to inform us of this known fact ? Still, no mention of
Saudi Arabia.

Who do we imagine is providing financial support to the Sunnis' ? Saudi
Arabia..

hmmmm.. This can't be such a deliberate omission of mention, can it ?
Consider the
makeup of the panel, itself.. James Baker III.. consigliore of the Bush
family and their
ties to the Saudis'.. His firm also represents the Saudis' in many of their
investments
in world affairs, especially American and certainly in the Middle East.. Lee
Hamilton
also heads a law firm which is closely tied to Saudi interests around the
globe..

No mention of the Saudi influence in the affairs of Baghdad.. That seems a
little
strange. The hijackers who flew the planes into our centers of commerce and
the
Pentagon, on 9/11/2001, were predominantly Saudis.. The head of the
organization
Al Queda. was a son of one of the most influential families of Saudi
Arabia.. Saudi
Arabia is also one of the leading influences in OPEC.. In almost all the
terrorist
disasters of this past decade, Saudi Arabia has been the shadowy figure that
has been
discovered on the fringes of the events..

The Baker/Hamilton committee has called upon Syria and Iran to withdraw
their
support of the warring groups in Iraq.. They've called upon Syria and Iran
to
lend their support to brokerage of a reconciliation between the feuding
parties..
Why isn't Saudi Arabia being pressed to withdraw their support for the
Sunnis'.?

Why did the committee not call on Saudi Arabia, to involve themselves in the
brokerage of reconciliation in Iraq ? They are our friends and allies..
Syria and
Iran have been at odds with U.S. policy in the region for decades.. There is
a lot
of speculation about their sincerity of support for any American strategy ..
If we
can solicit and gain their support.. that would pave the way for a permanent
solution to the Middle East controversy.. Is there another and more devious
reason
why there is no mention of Saudi Arabia in this report ?

The first knee jerk reaction was to breathe a sigh of relief .. On first
glance, this
report indicates a light at the end of the tunnel.. After all, the report
firmly places
blame for the Iraq debacle, at the dorrstep of the incompetent
administration..
Stopping just short of accusing them of criminal liability.. For anyone who
is
opposed to George Bush, that is a breath of fresh air.. At last.. someone is
telling
it like it is.. Or, are they telling us the entire and complete story ? This
report
should be carefully considered and the questions need to asked..

Bill Walker
Irving

 

==Not only that--, but President Bush's reaction to the report was
pathetic.
He is steal in denial.
He just ===had==== to say, that ''yes I agree with parts of the
committee's recomendations, but not all.''
--The bipartisan group assessed the situatiion in Iraq as;''grave and
deteriorating.'' This was the mighty opinion demostrated by the voters
a few weeks ago. Amen

It specifically noted that even if all steps were initiated, that there
is still no guaranttee, but something needs to be done in the immediate
future.
Hamilton went on to say, it needs to be activated in a matter of days.

It outlined and presented to Bush 79 specific steps, that may help to
improve the situation.

So, who knows how many of the steps Bush agrees with, maybe 25. (grin)

The study group flat out reported that ''just about everything the Bush
admin. has done so far in that country was mis handeled.''

He needs to admit, that the Invasion or socalled war in Iraq, needs to
end, those young women and men, need to come home.
The USA & UK have done their part, it is up to the better half of the
evil in Iraq to defend their beliefs.

Bull headed Bush needs to admit, that if the Iraqi Army isnt ready now,
they never will be.
He must be lonely, because he's the only one that still thinks there's a
chance of that country becoming a democracy.

Lastly,It is sad to think of who the last US Soldier to die in Iraq,
will be.

B. Jay Kana--
NETexas
03Valk-&-98 Magna
Have a Dandy Day--

 

Worse yet is that was never a possibility. Iraq as we know it today
has never been a true historical or geographical country. Further the
people there have thousands of years of history and culture that could
not be changed by importing MacDonalds and Krispy Kream franchises.

I said it when the ground war started and I will say it again, if your
goal is to convert Iraq to a democracy, you best dig in for the long
haul cuz it will take generations to accomplish. Our Western attention
span is way too short for that kind of a commitment.

Go big, occupy it, take it over, overwhelm it with our people and
culture. Totally destroy the Arab culture and be prepared to defend
yourself with a vengeance, similar with what happened in Israel, or go
home.

Knowing "Go Big" is not an option, the US needs to move forward very
carefully here. Recall in Viet Nam what the realization the war was
lost had on the moral of the soldiers. Who wants to put their life in
harms way, if the writing is on the wall you are pulling out.

Also if the US and Britain pull out of Iraq, leaving the country to
fall into a civil war and eventually be dissolved into multiple tribes
controlled by Iran and Syria, are we not left with a situation worse
than in Saddam's day.

What will all of those lives lost have been sacrificed for?

It's been said a thousand times before, but Saddam was controllable
through the UN and sanctions. When he got too far out of line, we
could shake him up with a few long range missiles.

Now, the eventual winner of this conflict, Iran, will be able to
control most of Iraq, use it for whatever nefarious purpose they
desire, all the while staying safe inside their established borders,
secure in the knowledge the US or their allies will not be invading
another Middle East country for at last another generation.

They now have a twenty year get out of jail free card to create
mischief over there. Think of the technology they currently have and
will have ten years from now to perform that mischief. Very scary.

Folks this war will not end, with the evacuation of troops from Iraq.

It is only starting.




--


24 hours in a day
&
24 beer in a case

Coincidence?

I think not

 

There have been so many flip flops by George Bush, it is hard to keep
track of all of them.. Coming to mind, of course is the opposition of
Bush to the 911 Commission.. Bush and Cheney both fought a hard
battle to keep that Commission being formed.. Then they did it, calling
it their idea.. etc. etc.

The Iraq Study Group has thrown George Bush a life preserver in this
case.. typical Bush, he is stalling and considering other reports..

When this report is studied carefully, it isn't much more than a watered
down version of what we've had with the current Bush policies.. The
only diviation is the inclusion of Syria and Iran in these deliberations..
Instead of "staying the course".. America will only be "staying half the
course".. by withdrawing 70,000 of our troops from Iraq..

By including Saudi Arabia into the mix, which isn't mentioned in this
report.. the entire powder keg, might be defused..

Knee jerk acceptance of this report on face value could be a sad mistake
for America.. The political environment in our government is making
some radical changes in this upcoming year.. George Bush is facing
challenges which he has never confronted before.. A hostile Congress
and Senate will be a novel experience for this president.. Even.. the
very real possibility of impeachment and criminal prosecution is rearing
it's head.. The recent meltdown of H.W. in Florida could be a lot more
significant than anyone realizes.. For sure.. 2007 will be an interesting
year in our nations' capitol..

Bill Walker
Irving

 

Check Bill Walker's profile!!!!

Don't let him pollute this group.

He's a communist!

He poaches in dozens and dozens of other groups and spouts off his
communist crap.

Here's one of his recent writings:

"Karl Marx teaches us that it will go on until the Proletariat rises up
against the Capitalists in a Bloody Revolution - like what happened in
China.
Now China is the only remaining superpower. "


TexGEOas

 

ROTFLMAO.. **** off.. Check your own damned profile, you idiot...

 

''When this report is studied carefully, it isn't much more than a
watered down version of what we've had with the current Bush policies..
The only diviation is the inclusion of Syria and Iran in these
deliberations.. Instead of "staying the course".. America will only be
"staying half the course".. by withdrawing 70,000 of our troops from
Iraq..



A good exception is; Lame man Bush aint the head knocker any more, cause
he has the Democrats swarming him, and most republicans are shunning
him.
And I dont see the report as a watered down version at all. I see it as
a thick mixture of frankness, telling him he screwed up, and the voters
want something done quickly, and they are implying Bush needs to realize
that it is beyond our control anymore, as far as staying any longer.


B. Jay Kana--
NETexas
03Valk-&-98 Magna
Have a Dandy Day--

 

<chuckle> Needless to say.. I've never quoted "Karl Marx" in my enitre
life..
By the time I was 18 years old, I'd already killed more communists than this
moron has ever seen.. Regards, Morgan Kane

Bill Walker

 

The $$$$ hungry Saudi Arabian want no parts of any of this mess, That been
their position form the start. Just another ugly war were elected idiots
get to send the sons & daughters of the working class to die.

Can someone tell me what is in Afghanistan (sp) the is worth the 15 years of
Russian blood and now 5 years of American blood.?

 

(TexGEOas)
Check Bill Walker's profile!!!!
Don't let him pollute this group.
He's a communist!
He poaches in dozens and dozens of other groups and spouts off his
communist crap.
Here's one of his recent writings:
"Karl Marx teaches us that it will go on until the Proletariat rises up
against the Capitalists in a Bloody Revolution - like what happened in
China.
Now China is the only remaining superpower. "
TexGEOas




Say TexGeoAss, I wish I could meet you in person. Surely do, then I
would give you a quarter, and encourage you to use the quarter to go
call someone,‘‘who gives a shit what you think’’. know what I'm
sayin.

B. Jay Kana--
NETexas
03Valk-&-98 Magna
Have a Dandy Day--

 

It is an idictment of the Bush/Cheney policies, that's for sure..

I might add that I'll make a slight adjustment to my comments in the
original
post.. There was, in fact.. a "mention" of Saudi Arabia that I missed..
It seems that James Baker III did include Saudi Arabia in the report.. There
was a "mention" briefly, when he was naming the regional countries who
should be involved in an advisory capacity. Iran, Syria and Saudi Arabia
were amongst the ones he specified.. My mistake.. I just overlooked it..

Bill Walker

 

Not to be directed at anyone specific, I just thought this would be a
good place to post my comments.

I can recall several years ago when the build-up to invasion was
underway. Those of us who said to over-throw the government in Iraq
would mean an occupation and a large scale civil war were labelled as
"unpatriotic". Those of us who would say there's no way to win without
just declaring Iraq a 51st state were said how stupid we were and how
we had the best military in the world.

There were many people who said in the beginning and all through the
90s when there was talk over taking Saddam Hussein out of power that to
do so would be too long and costly of an event and we'd have nothing to
gain in the end. The idea that the US military could invade Iraq,
capture/kill their government officials and topple a government....then
leave, it's just plain stupid! It always was stupid!

Now we're in an occupation mode of 3000 killed (only counting the
military, not the contractors) and tens of thousands seriously wounded.
We still have a worse situation over there. When it started going
really bad, we were told it was the "insurgents" causing the problem.
Without looking up what the word meant, people believed it and thought
if we killed off all the "insurgents" the people of Iraq would finally
be free. The people killing our military ARE the people of Iraq. We
toppled the government that held that country together, expect those
people to throw flowers at our feet and have the world one happy place.
All the people now speaking out against what we've got now and who went
along with it in the beginning don't have a single right to switch. You
can't! Those are 3000 people who were sent over to a country to die,
and now because it wasn't well thought about and a bunch of pimple
faced pricks thought it was like a video game where they could turn off
when you start losing, people want to switch opinions? Most of those
people act like they were always on that side.

Well folks, to sum it up (and since I've got to go north...be seeing
you if I can Vic...where in Michigan are you?) you got what you voted
for. We don't need to switch or "cut and run". We're there for the long
haul now...for better or worse. The only thing we CAN do at this point
is to declare Iraq the 51st state and move on. It's either that or we
pull out saving lives from being lost, and then we created a haven for
breeds of terrorists. Welcome to the jungle!

 

"Brian Walker"

A little town called "Caro". It's about 100 miles north of Detroit, and
about 30 miles east of Saginaw. It's on most maps, if you get close give a
shout, and I'll have the coffee ready. Email me at for
a phone number. Safe travels to you Brian, looking forward to meeting you.

Vic

 

Sheesh.. I didn't know I was a communist, either.. <chuckle> Like I said
in
another deal, here.. "I never quoted Karl Marx in my life".. Maybe, I was
drunk, or something..

Sanders Kaufman posts on tx.politics.. Good Republican and he sure don't car
for
George Bush.. I frequent three newsgroups.. tx.motorcycles, rec.motorcycles
and
tx.politics.. I guess ol' texgeoas is counting a lot of cross posts that I
respond to..

<grin> He sure don't read "friendly" to me.. Not sure why he is taking dead
aim
on me, though.. I don't recall having any kind of exchange with the guy..

Dang.. that old boy is busy, huh ? And.. rides a Harley, too.. lol...
Well, that
don't make him a bad person..

I'm sorry, don't believe I know the gent.. That don't mean a whole lot,
though..
<wide smile> Seems to be a lot of folks around, who'd like to be famous..
Some of them have claimed to know me, in the past. Maybe ol' texgeoas is
one of those.. do you suppose ?

On another note.. how's things going with you ? I'm looking forward to
getting out a bit more, soon as this cold snap is finished.. and I'm up to
it..
Do you think you will be ready to do a little trip, pretty soon ? Regards

Bill Walker
Irving

 

You're in luck! The closest I'll be getting that way will be about 250
miles.

It's nice that you're reading each and every one of my postings
though....

 

Awww, that's a pity Brian, I was so much looking forward to it.

No problem, most of them are good for at least a chuckle.

Vic

 

Brian if you are serious: ''Email me at for a
phone number. Safe travels to you Brian, looking forward to meeting you.
      Vic

Brian responds:
You're in luck! The closest I'll be getting that way will be about 250
miles.



Shoot, Brian, we all know that if you were within 25 miles, you wouldnt
have make the effort. You're just blowing stale air.
--chuckle--

B. Jay Kana--
NETexas
03Valk-&-98 Magna
Have a Dandy Day--

 

Is that coming from the same usenet pussy who couldn't seem to find the
Shell station in Mt Pleasant?

 

(Brian Walker)
_______________________________

Brian if you are serious: ''Email me at for a
phone number. Safe travels to you Brian, looking forward to meeting you.
              Vic


Brian responds:
You're in luck! The closest I'll be getting that way will be about 250
miles.



Shoot, Brian, we all know that if you were within 25 miles, you wouldn't
have make the effort. You're just blowing stale air. --chuckle--




bjay--Is that coming from the same usenet =pussy= who couldn't seem to
find the Shell station in Mt Pleasant? Brian--




Red-Shads main man, got his wires crossed. It was not ''Shell'' it was
McDonalds,where we were to meet, so I could make the ''long ride'' with
them. (grin)
You and Bill Fright are so childish, by using the noun ''pussy''
referring to grown men on here. I speculate that it helps to strengthen
a point in =your little mind=.
What else I say(?) --grin--

B. Jay Kana--
NETexas
03Valk-&-98 Magna
Have a Dandy Day--

 

That's okay, I managed to make more 25 mile efforts in a day than you
have in your lifetime. Chalk that up how you will. The point was you
couldn't find a Shell station in the town where you lived and I managed
to make a ride from Dallas to Mena after working all day and still have
time to enjoy good company...and a good ride the next day.

It must really suck for you to sit on that porch while the big dogs
play, huh Sparky?

BTW, nothing is more "childish" than to sit on a usenet group trying to
stir up a bunch of shit, then whine and cry your way out of backing up
your bullshit. So, you can stick that "childish" remark up your ass.