Oil, filters...

First service time (in a few days, anyhoo). What's
the good oil for a ZZR250? Anyone know where on
Sydney's north shore that will sell me a filter
(that isn't Sydney City Motorcycles, of course!).

TIA,

G

 

you could order it from www.maw.com.au

and not have to go anywhere

or if you wish to go somewhere google for mechanics and there is a couple of
guys on the northside that could help you out

also could head into the city to MCA on wentworth ave ? or actions

 

Steer clear of Northside tho...

google will reveal why, if you care...

Yeah, MCA in town (or in Parra) will have what you want.

As for oil, I'm using (and am very happy with) Motul 5100 - you can
usually pick up a 4L container of it for just under $40 from MCA.

If I remember rightly, you're still running that thing in, aren't you?
Lots of people recommend steering clear of synthetic oils until 5,000km
or so, on the grounds that they lubricate _too_ well, and don't let the
run in process work properly, so a cheap mineral oil might be better
(I'm not too sure of the truth in this claim though...)

big

 

Iain Chalmers wrote:


Snip heaps...

Iain, Why have you changed to the fully synthetic oil? Do you race the
bike?

Mineral oil will lubricate just the same as synthetic oil (at normal
operating conditions) - I can't see the value of spending shit loads
more on oil when the bike is used for normal road use - I do not
believe that the the likes of Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki, Kawasaki and the
multitudes of other bike makers recommending that a mineral oil of
either SF or SG grade will suffice in their motors only to have a bike
shop say you need synthetic oil?

Definately not a cheap mineral oil... but a recognised grade (SF min)

cheers
Johno

 

In aus.motorcycles on Mon, 29 Dec 2003 19:09:52 +1030

The main advantage of synthetic is that it survives being cut up by the
gearbox longer.

For a high mileage bike under a reasonable load - which describes the
Spada pretty well - this is a Good Thing.

The factories aren't that interested in having your bike survive for
100,000+ km and many years. You may be.

Zebee
- who uses cheapish dino oil in the Guzzi because it has a separate
gearbox. The Yam will probably stay on dino oil cos it's changed
more often for time reasons than mileage. The Ducati eats straight 50,
I don't think they make that in synthetic.

 

This may well be the case, however, I believe that if the mineral oil
is changed regularly (ie, bike makers recommended milage) then there
will always be fresh oil in the gearbox.

Are you implying that the spada would not be in the same condition if
it was run purely on mineral oil and all servicing was done by the
book?

Should be easily achievable on mineral oil - again, as long as the
service is done by the book.

which I assume will do the intended jod

The Ducati eats straight 50,

and that will go for ages

 

Do you have Fuches down your way ?. they do make a 50 weight in pure
synth , hard to get but available.

 

I have to laugh sometime about people wont use some shop for a $15 item
"oh they are crooks"
"oh they did a bad service on a mate's, brother's girlfriend's ex roommates
cousin's gay lover's Vespa"

if you cant get one closer, just buy it off them...its an oil filter ffs

who is it really inconvenienced? the dealer, cos you don't buy a $15 part of
them or you for running around Sydney wasting your time and money???

for servicing or buying a bike...then chose the dealer

mh

 

Nah, the 5100 is not full synth, its "Semi-synthetic" accorting to
Motul... from:

<http://www.motul.co.jp/eg/product_line_up/4stroke/4stroke11.html>

"Specially developed for engines that require simultaneous lubrication
with its transmission applications, 5100 ESTER 10W-40 maintains
stability and ensures less friction even at extreme temperatures or
under heavy loads. With its extreme pressure additives, gear shifts are
enhanced. 5100 ESTER 10W-40 guarantees efficient wet clutch performance
as well as gearbox longevity."

I mainly use it because it was recommended by a mechanic I trust (who,
unfortnately, is no longer in the business). I used to use Aral fully
synthetic, but its become less easy to get hold of, where just about
every bike shop stock Motul.

I'm not sure how much I believe the "this oil is specially developed for
use in motorcycles" marketing blurb that all the oil companies use to
convince you to spend twice as much as their similarly graded "car
oils", but it does seem to me that combined motor/gearbox lubrication
and wet clutches do throw additional challenges at motorcycle oils, and
the marginal extra cost of the Motul oil is small enough that I'm happy
to buy it for even some possibly fictitious "extra motorcycle
protection" (especially since the Spada takes less than 2L on an oil
change).

I don't race the bike, but I do thrash it occasionally (trackdays only,
of course, officer!), and I do quite a lot of km (its up around
180,000km now).

big (besides, buying bike oil is an excuse to go to the bikeshop! ;-)

 

Iain Chalmers wrote:

snip again...

Yes, agreed, the cost per oil change would not be that noticable.

would be interesting to see a comparison between the syn and min oil
over the same time / milage

We *need an excuse to go to the bike shop?

Johmo

 

I'm pretty sure thats true... It gets new (semi synth) oil and a new
filter[1] every 5,000km - the "book" say it only needs oil and filters
at 10,000km. I'm convinced that the good oil and frequent changes
contributes to its longevity. And even if it doesn't, all its costing me
is maybe an extra $40 or so[2] per 10,000km, thats not exactly going to
break the bank...

I work this bike pretty hard - a trackday every couple of months, a
2,000+km trip a few times a year, and an occasional long trip too[3], as
well as commuting 80km a day and zooming around on it most weekends...
Most people don't expect a 250cc bike to last 100,000km - I'm heading
for 200,000km on this one...

I should admit though, I killed the first motor at 120,000km by
downshifting _way_ to early on the way into turn 9 at Eastern Creek a
couple of years back - did the big ends, and replaced the whole motor
with a 10,000km old one from the wreckers. The new motor has 70,000km on
it now, and apart from the rattly cam chain (the first motor had the cam
chain and tensioners replaced at 70,000km too), its still running strong.

big

[1] OK, I'll admit, it occasionally doesn't get a new filter if I don't
happen to have one handy, but I make sure I never skip replacing the
filter twice in a row, so it _always_ get a new filter at least every
10,000.

[2] I use $40 worth of oil and $16 worth of filterts per 10,000km, I
_could_ use maybe $10 of oil and $8 of filters if I used "cheap" oil and
only 1 filter change per 10,000 like the "book" says - pretty cheap
piece of mind, even if it doesn't help ;-)

[3] 6,300km Sydney to Lyndhurst and back about a year ago:
http://www.mightymedia.com.au/~bigiain/bug_collecting/eclipse/

 

OK, find me a Spada with 180,000km on it thats always used dinosaur oil
;-)

big (yeah yeah, I'm cheating, make it a 120,000km Spada ;-)

 

OK. If you care to give pointers in that regard, my email
address is a real one.

I am... *yawn*

Yup, Kath warned me off synthetic oils earlier today for much the
same reason. Also cited potential for strange and non-desirable
behaviour from wet clutches.

The book says 10W-40, and that's it. Not a lot to go on there.

It sounds like a reasonable claim to me. I don't know much about
bikes, but i'm pretty familiar with most other things with
injuns in them, and the same principle holds true elsewhere:
overlubricate at run-in time is a Bad Thing (tm).


G

 

Then if you have your mind made up, why bother asking?

 

You got that right! It's a principle thing. Sydney City Motorcycles
at Lane Cove tried to screw me once, they got caught, and now they've
lost me as a customer, in all contexts, for life. Simple really.

G

 

Oil is designed to lubricate for ever! Why change it?

Hammo

 

On 29/12/03 8:38 PM, in article

"I'm pretty sure that¹s true". Convincing argument. How do you know that
the oil you are using is any better because it claims to be semi-synthetic?

I'm more convinced that a bike that does lots of [constant] mileage will
outlast one that does short stop start stuff. I'm convinced that
contaminated oil is no better if it is synthetic, synth fortified, or
mineral.

If you are changing it it so frequently why not buy it buy the 44? I also
have so snake oil for you try.....

Hammo (hmm, must be optimax time too....)

 

where is BTH when you need him ??

go for a google and you will find that your bike will do 100K using cheap
crap valvoline car oil

no need for that fancy schmancy bike oil

 

I use a shell semi-synthetic bike oil in the GPX engine (and
co-incidentally, the same one in the ZX10 engine). Cost is about $30 for a
4L? (From what my morning-fuzzed memory says.)

Filter is $10, and I do it every 2nd change. (I change the oil every 5000km
though.)

Both from Motorcycle Accessories in Parra. (They are also in Sydney though.)

I also always replace the drain bolt washer every second change these days
(you only make that mistake once). Add another $1? Seeing as I use less than
half the 4L in an oil change, it averages out at just over $20 per 5000km.

If I was a cheapskate, and followed the service manual exactly, then I
wouldn't ever replace the washer (service manual doesn't say to, what's up
with that?) and would only do the oil and filter every 10,000km with the
cheapest oil of the appropriate spec available. Would cost me about $15
every 10000km. Seeing as the ZX10 is up to 130,000km, and still doesn't even
need a new cam-chain yet (and based on the measurements, won't for another
50000km odd) I'm pretty happy with the results.

 

"Hamish Alker-Jones" wrote

I used commercially recycled oil in my first car.

1949 Morris 8 van, and no, I didn't buy it new.

Theo