IDS

Yes, but let's look at the severity of what's been going on. The "Back
To Basics" campaign was prompted by there not being a week passing
without another Tory being revealed as an adulterer. Even funnier was
that John Major was boffing Currie. There's Archer, and Aitken, and
Matrix Churchill, and Gerrymandering.

The Labour "scandals" have been what: Robin Cook having an affair, a
couple of MPs sending their kids to private school, and "ooh, look how
much tax has gone up by".

My mud-slinging is politically motivated. I don't claim to be an
unbiased observer, a reader of every newspaper and free spirit.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not happy with the situation, but I'd rather
have Blair than Thatch.

 

Oh come on, what about the undeclared loans between Robertson and
Mandleson?

What about Robertson's business dealings?

What about Keith Vaz's blatent lies. What about the Hinduja affair?

What about the 'bung' that Bernie Ecclestone gave to Labour?

What about the fact that Jeff Hoon and Alaistair Campbell drove a public
servant to commit suicide?

I'm sure there's much more if I could be bothered to stop and think.

No, nothing to the scale of Aitken and Archer has come to light yet,
granted. But again, none of the things you mentioned had come to the
surface in the first 7 years. It was all in the last 5 or so.

Good! So's mine.

I'd rather have Major than Blair. Despite boffing Currie he was a
decent bloke IMO and did a reasonable job under difficult circumstances.

We'll see how history judges him; probably ignores him I guess.

 

Ben Blaney :

Money for tobacco advertising in F1; UK passports for criminals for money;
selling arms to repressive regimes despite manifesto promises of an
ethical foreign policy; one war abroad per year in power; the lies about war
in Iraq; the return of internment; the attempt to remove the right to
trial by jury for many offences; the latest version of the RIP act; the
current state of emergency, despite possibly the lowest terrorist threat
for decades.

And that's just off the top of my head.

A few bits of away shagging are so much less important than the real
scandalous behaviour, I'm surprised you saw fit to mention them.

 

Hog wrote

Lovely and warm in the winter if you wear a two piece and the seams
don't quite keep out the draught at the back.

 

Yes. That was my point.

Hopefully if the Labour Party stay in for another ten years, I'll see
some of the policies I support being put into place...

Funnily enough, me too.

In Free At Last, the edition of Tony Benn's diaries which chart 1991 to
2001, John Major comes out very creditably. Tony Blair doesn't. That's
good enough for me.

 

This isn' exclusive to Labour Govt.

Asil Nadir?

This has *always* gone on.

Fair point.

This isn't "sleaze".

Nor is this.

Nor is this.

Or this.

Or this.

Or this.

That's mostly policies you disagree with. burnt and I were talking
about sleaze.

Well, if you want to talk about real scandalous behaviour, The Tories
will still win the count by a country mile.

 

That would be a cautious man, nothing wrong in that.
So Windy was wrong !

Must be Snetterton

That would be MPs, definitely yes. The first few rounds of MEPs was
completely different. More the case of who the f*ck can we get.
"Oi Niel is the Misses available!"

Bear asked me to adopt him when he found out I had a 'walk in' booze
cabinet'

Actually it was:
First time, "Would you consider representing us in Europe as an MEP?"
Answer: No

Second time, "You'd be a great MEP, Mick. Would you come along to the
next meeting and have a chat?" I did and decided after a *long*
'interview' at it was not for me.

Half the time it's spent talking it down otherwise people don't believe
me.

Champ knows I can wind him up.

FX "Hi Champ!"

 

When NuLab got in I would have agreed with you for the first year..

A perfect ticket would have been Blair leading the Torys.
Well it almost happened he just didn't tell the rest they had changed
sides.

I don't know if he was a better politician than say Major, the grey man
was *far* better than he came across, history may treat him better than
Spitting Image did.

Now was it Curry that had him or the other way round?

 

This fits with what I know of the recruitment to the European Parliament of
a Belgian who now heads one of the distribution businesses we deal with. He
had achieved a certain level of success in business and was approached by
some party or other. Did his stint, learnt much in the process and now the
company he runs is distinguished from the competition by the effectiveness
with which it applies lobbying techniques to key decision makers. They
quite simply have the biggest expense accounts in town.

 

You didn't read my posting on how I set up a fine upstanding member of
the governments front bench via a labour MP who was on the JPSC?

I think that Clark was a fool to pull the UK out of Ariane 5 and a
bigger fool to ask on his visit to Toulouse why there wasn't a Union
Jack on the Ariane 5 model that he saw there.

Well done!

One does need lots of readies to keep his type of life style going.
Dealing with people he always paid promptly. Or so I'm told by my old
locals.
The library in his castle at Saltwood was considered outstanding. I
thought the place was the dogs naggers. Draw bridge portcullis etc.

I just thought.
Ken Warren went from business to a candidate for Hastings over night
(Sir Ken now). Got the seat and then Hastings and Rye. I was an
apprentice working for him at Rank Cintel in Lower Sydenham before he
became MP. He even remembered me in a departure lounge at Gatwick
1988(?) twenty something years later. He came over to ask if he knew me
as he never forgot a face. Which wasn't bad as there was a beard
covering the face second time around.

But what you have said would apply to candidates for MP for an
established party. MEPs as I said in a separate post were all together a
different thing when it all started.

 

Ben Blaney :

Accepting money to change stated policy is 'sleaze'

It is scandalous, /political/ sleaze - i.e. lying to the electorate,
accepting money for policy, doing exactly the opposite of the manifesto
promises.

Robin Cook shagging someone is not at all important, especially when
compared with Robin Cook saying that Tony Blair intentionally mislead
parliament & country.

 

Ben Blaney wrote

So when do we get the url with the tits at the end then?

 

Champ wrote

You mean.... it wasn't suicide?

 

And the *yet* was my point.

That's as maybe but it wasn't what we were discussing. If anyone can
remember all of the tory scandle by 1986 I'd be grateful. All I can
remember was Cecil Parkinson and his affair.

Well I can see that Tony Benn would have a problem with Tony Blair and
not with John Major; he may see Blair as a traitor to the cause or
something along those lines.

 

<shocked>

 

And this is different to the Tory record how?

 

The pinnacle of sleaze IMO was Matrix Churchill - the Attorney General
attempting to use PII certificates to suppress evidence in a criminal trial
which he knew would exonerate the defendants, in order to cover up for the
Chief Secretary to the Treasury having lied to Parliament about supplying
arms to dictators. And then paying millions for a judicial enquiry, during
the preparation of which the Ministers involved were allowed to scrutinise
and comment line-by-line, but the Opposition were only given three hours to
read the finished article (and that under supervision) before a full
set-piece debate. During which Tory MPs (with an overall majority) were
told that it was a confidence vote if it went against the Government, and a
vindication of all concerned if it went in favour.

I won't even consider voting Tory until every single Tory MP who voted in
that debate has retired or left the party.

 

Jesus yes, Cecil: what a slimeball he was. I cannot, to this day,
understand what motivated *even the Tories* to allow him to associate
himself with them. That wasn't hair oil and flesh lube he was dripping
with. That was concentrated sleaze coming out of the pores.
Conservative Central Office must have had to hire a skivvy to follow him
around, sponging up the oleaginous condescension. That he could have
found a woman prepared even to touch him beggars belief.

That Thatcher was prepared to sponsor the greasy creep is
incontrovertible proof of the rottenness at the heart of the
Conservative party.

--
Platypus - Faster Than Champ
VN800 Drifter, R80RT
DIAABTCOD#2 GPOTHUF#19
BOTAFOS#6 BOTAFOT#89 FTB#11
BOB#1 SBS#35 ANORAK#18 TWA#15

 

Just zis Guy, you know? wrote

Golly gosh. If I were an alien looking in on this thread I could be
forgiven for jumping wildly to the conclusion that British politicians,
regardless of party allegiances, all seem to be tarred with the same
corrupt brush.

Aren't we lucky that it is not really like that boys and girls?

 

My Mum's verdict on Porkinsword: "How could anybody sleep with /that?/"