help getting bike started - 2004 suzuki rv125

Hi,

I've just had a bit if a bike drama. 6 weeks ago my battery died.
Unfortunately, I was just about to go on holiday so didn't have time to
fix it. I returned 6 weeks later fitted a new battery, pulled out the
choke, crossed my fingers, hit the starter button. I could hear the
starter motor go but after several attemps nothing...

So, I take a look around my bike and although I left it with a full
tank it sounds suspiciously empty. To my horror I then realise that
some little f***er has cut my fuel hose and drained me dry - aaargh!

My next move is to replace the hose and fill her up with super. On my
next attempt to start her I am sure I heard some combustion for a
moment but after that the bike is either dead or sulking with me for
leaving it out in the cold.

What do you guys think I should try next?

The fact that I am sure I got a moment of combustion makes me doubt a
spark plug problem - I will get one in the morning regardless though.

The poor thing could have sat there with an empty tank for weeks. Since
filling the tank and attempting to start the bike I have heard that
water may have condensed in the tank and mixed with the fuel. What
could I do about this?

Another suggestion has been taking out the sparks, and rotating the
rear wheel before replacing the plugs - would this achieve anything?

Could the carb be damaged?

Before I get flamed for leaving my bike out in the cold please believe
me that nobody feels as stupid as I do now and it is a mistake I will
never make again. I bit like the one where you leave the lights on all
night and destroy the battery

Many thanks for any pointer.

Regards,

Paul

 

paul wrote

Presumably this was done by scrotes and not a jealous lover and as such
you have reported it as an act of criminal damage to your bike and got
some charcoal in for later wen said scrotes get caught?

Stuff. Depends dunnit?

Your money I suppose but there is a lot of diagnostics you can do for
free before you even think about leaving home and why spend money on
replacement parts until you are sure it is and why it is?

It may not water, it may be something much more simple but it is very
likely it is associated with the cut hose.

For years now, as a sort of safety feature, a lot of bikes have a fuel
tap that has a pipe go to the carbs somewhere to act as a sort of vacuum
powered valve to only allow petrol through when the engine is running.
A good idea but right pisser when the reason the bike isn't running is a
chronic lack of petrol in the first place. To solve this little problem
the manufacturers and Mr Suzuki is foremost amongst them fitted an extra
position to the fuel tap often called "Prime", not because it is first
amongst positions but because it's purpose is to allow unrestricted flow
of fuel to the carb from the tank even if the engine is not running.
Have you investigated this? Free it is.

Make a few spiders homeless is about all.

This advice seems based upon the premise that the engine is not turning
(something you disagree with) and is designed to make you do so
manually. A waste of fucking time and effort if you ask me, starter
motors are a zillion times better at turning engines.

Depends dunnit, does it look damaged?

You don't destroy batteries by leaving the lights on all night, you will
discharge it.

You have had you advice now **** off and leave us alone.

 

Angle Grinder.

Failing that, change the spark plugs,


Dave

 

Change them without checking them?
You obviously have too much money if that is the extent of your
diagnostic ability.

 

Yep. Thats about right.
At 4 quid a time, its not worth farting about with them.
I keep a new, spare set in the shed - just in case.

Dave

 

chippy came up with the following;:

My Fantic Trials eats plugs ('90/'91 207 156cc 2 stroke single). It really
isn't worth checking the plug, so if it doesn't start from cold by the
fourth kick, I just change it.

The plugs always appear oily, and suggest an over-rich mixture or wrong
pre-mix levels, but changing mixtures and pre-mixes makes absolutely no
difference, they still foul up and won't work, even after burning off on a
gas cooker. I was told the coils or rotor gives out a very weak spark and
can seriously screw up the plugs, I dunno, but I do know that checking them,
cleaning, gapping, etc is simply not worth it at all.

When it's fired up and run for more than 10 seconds or so it doesn't matter,
it'll stop and start forever, it seems, and the colour is lovely so the
'hot' mixture and pre-mix do actually seem right, it's just the cold
starting that's apparently disastrous.

We've cleaned the carb thoroughly, tried different jets, changed all the
seals and put hours and hours of work into the carburation but still it eats
plugs. The ignition when tested gives out good numbers, I'm told by a
Fantic fan, and there appears to be no reason behind it other than Italian
temperament ...

 

paul came up with the following;:

Be easier to remove the plugs and use the starter ...
Then replace the plugs and try again. I'd use new plugs. Many strokers are
happiest with new plugs and I used to carry a set of spares when I used to
runmy KH250. Nowadys I buy them in boxes of 24 (I think) for my Fantic ...

Unlikely, but it's possible the bastards screwed with it when they cut the
hose, or a bit of hose could be inside the carb, blocking the flow. Might
be worth removing the carb and cleaning it. A few weeks isn't enough time
IWHT to get any fuel residue TICBW.

It'll probably discharge the battery but unlikely to destroy it.

 

Paul - xxx said...

Try sticking NGK V plugs in. If it takes something like a B8ES, try a
B8EV. One of my RD400s suffered the same thing but this cured it.

 

Lozzo came up with the following;:

Close, B9ES .. We've tried B7's and B8's but they made it worse, it seemed.

I'll certainly try it though, thanks.

 

Paul - xxx said...

I wouldn't change the heat range, I'd just go for the gold palladium
plugs. You run the risk of holing a piston if you try a lower heat range
like an 8 or 7.

 

I used a (something) EV on a KH400 a few years back because it was
fouling plugs, the EV seemed to fix it (from memory)

 

Lozzo came up with the following;:

At the time we didn't have a manual, or anyone who 'knew' Fantics ... but
found an Italian web page with a reference that translated to B8. Then when
we spoke to Bill Pye (eventually got his name and address for Fantic spares
etc) he put us right. He didn't mention the V range though. Maybe all
Fantic owners just swap plugs as a matter of course ..

 

Indeed - I change mine every year, whether it needs it or not

--
Krusty.

http://www.muddystuff.co.uk
http://www.muddystuff.us
Off-road classifieds

'02 MV Senna '96 Tiger '79 Fantic 250

 

Didn't the KH or one of the Kwak triples have a set of plugs in a
factory-fitted foam box under the seat?

 

The S1 & S3 did as did the KH250 & 400.

A spare piston and rings for the middle cylinder wouldn't have amiss
in my experience.

 

Dan L scribbled on the back of a napkin:

AFAIK it's because it's running hotter. They probably increased the
piston to barrel clearance a tad to counteract this.

OTOH I may well be talking complete bollox but at the end of the day
this *is* UKRML.

 

Numpty question: Was the centre piston on the KH the same size as the outer
two?

I can certainly recall the middle piston being liable to seizing as several
acquaintances had KH's when I was a teenager, and I am sure one of them told
me it was due to it being a different size.

Mind you, this was prolly a load of old crap, and as I wasn't allowed a bike
I'd have believed anything (like the tale of the local hero's Garelli Tiger
Cross that achieved 70mph on the flat, then exploded next time it was
started).

--
Dan L (Oldbloke)

My bike 1996 Kawasaki ZR1100 Zephyr
Space in shed where NSR125 used to be
Spare Bike 1990 Suzuki TS50X (Patio Ornament)
BOTAFOT #140 (KotL 2005), X-FOT#000, DIAABTCOD #26, BOMB#18 (slow), OMF#11

 

They were on all the ones I worked on.

Smells like bullshit to me. The biggest causes of the middle cylinder
nipping (ime) were crud in the cooling fins making it run even hotter
than previously, cheap 2 stroke oil, garage floor engine tuning, badly
jetted carbs after fitting after market spannies or a mixture off all
the previous.

I left my 250 totally standard and never had a problem with it
nipping. Most of my friends went down the spannies + K&N route leading
to poor mixture and a need for an engine strip.

 

I think this may possibly explain it, as all my associates with 2 strokes
pursued the extraction of extra BHP with such enthusiasm, you know the kind
of thing; home built spannies, numpty carb tweaks and the like.

--
Dan L (Oldbloke)

My bike 1996 Kawasaki ZR1100 Zephyr
Space in shed where NSR125 used to be
Spare Bike 1990 Suzuki TS50X (Patio Ornament)
BOTAFOT #140 (KotL 2005), X-FOT#000, DIAABTCOD #26, BOMB#18 (slow), OMF#11

 

Not if it was put together properly. The centre pot siezed because it
got hotter.

*all* mopeds did at least 65mph when I was 16.