GL1500: Evans Waterless Cooling Q?

I know racers have been using Evans and read a GW tip site talking
about Evans NPG, a waterless coolant which is supposedly a performance
enhancer, plus requires no change out, EVER! However,I'm looking for
first hand knowledge of this approach?

BTW,I'm getting timing belts so will need to drain the system..a good
time to change it.

 

If you are having cooling problems (running hot in the summer, etc),
the Evans product will help you out.

However, if you blow a hose, or have a coolant leak, you must either
refill with Evans, or purge the system of Evans and add water.

If you are not having problems, I would stick to a high grade
radiator fluid. I use Spectro All Season Radiator fluid; no water. It
is more expensive than some other brands, but nothing ever settles out
of the fluid, and my radiator cores stay clean., no scale or
corrosion.


Jim Cook
Smackover Racing
Gas Gas DE300
Team LAGNAF
www.smackovermotorsports.com
Once you're Over the Hill, You just pick up Speed!

 

Engineers have never figured everything out and never will,where would
the world be if
we stopped developing,you'd be running wooden wheels on your bike
otherwise. ;=)

Evans Cooling product from what I've been reading..is an improvement
over conventional water-based cooling solutions.

 

http://www.evanscooling.com/catalog/C_npg1.htm

I certainly don't use the stuff, but there's the link to the
manufacturer.

Their claims are centered around three points, AFAICT:
1. Higher natural boiling point: means that the system can operate at
lower pressures, extending life of hoses and fittings. While it's true
that a higher natural boiling point should result in lower pressure
operation, all else being equal, it's important to note that the
pressure on the cap is not necessarily the pressure that the system is
operating at. Without actually testing the installation on your bike,
it's rather difficult to know whether you are operating at a lower
cooling system pressure or not. As for hose/fitting life, My bike's 12
years old and on original hoses and fittings. I don't know how much
longer one wants them to last.

2. Higher natural boiling point reduces localized boiling and vapor
formation, leading to increased cooling efficiency. Again, this is true
all else being equal. However, most road-going motorcycles do not have
difficulty with localized boiling, AFAIK. Race engines might very well
experience these problems as a result of increased state of engine tune
and the limitations on coolants allowed on the race-track.

WRT increased cooling efficiency, so long as one can keep the water from
boiling, it's difficult to find a more efficient fluid for removing heat
from something than water. If NPG coolants have poorer thermal
properties than water, then the efficiency gains resulting from
increased boiling point will be (partially, at least) offset by losses
in the efficiency of the heat transfer to the fluid.

3. "lifetime" coolant. Evans advertises their coolants as passing
10-year/500,000 mile in-vehicle tests for efficiency, etc. This might be
a good reason to change to Evans, if changing your coolant is too
onerous. It is worth noting however that:
a) These tests might not apply to motorcycles (I just don't know)
b) long-life coolants are available in many formulations
c) if you have to drain the coolant for another job having "lifetime"
coolant is less significant, because re-filling with new coolant is no
more difficult than putting the old stuff back.

A caution about NPG coolants. You need to make sure that it will work on
motorcycles. The original NPG coolants had a substantially higher
viscosity than ethylene glycol-based coolants, and wouldn't flow through
the smaller passages of a motorcycle's radiator, and would put
substantially more stress on your water pump. I see that Evans does
advertise a motorcycle-specific, low viscosity, formula.

Note also that they recommend a coolant change every year or every other
year "for maximum corrosion protection" with this product.

A final caution about NPG coolants, you won't be able to top up your
cooling system with water (or anything other than Evans NPG-R, actually)
on the road if you use this product. Make sure that you have a ready
supply of coolant, and/or to make sure that anyone doing work on your
bike knows what you've got in it so that they don't screw it up by
adding water.

And that pretty much explains why I don't use the stuff in my bike: it
may or may not be better than what I'm currently using. OTOH, my bike
doesn't overheat either. Furthermore, the advantages of keeping my bike
stock outweigh the advantages offered by NPG coolants. That's my
opinion, and my reasoning. Your situation may differ, and your
conclusions might change as a result. fwiw

--
Later,
John



'indiana' is a 'nolnn' and 'hoosier' is a 'solkk'. Indiana doesn't solkk.

 

An excellent summary, John.

One note: If one is having problems with overheating, and nothing
else has helped, the Evans coolant will drop your operating temps from
20 to 40 degrees F.

The above information is from the mechanic for the 2004 Gas Gas GNCC
Team quad riders. The riders on the 4-stroke quads were having a hard
time keeping coolant in them.
First, they tried an improved water pump housing and an improved water
pump impeller. This helped, but not enough.
They switched to Evans coolant, which brought their operating temps
down from 240 F to 205 F. It does have better heat transfer
properties.

Having said that, I wont use it, because my bike(s) don't need it.
Also, If I were to need to top off the radiator during a ride, I can
currently use anything from creek water, to water from my camelbak, to
human urine. It doesn't matter. If it is a relatively clean water
soluble liquid, it will work.

It isn't broke, and I'm not going to fix it.

Jim Cook
Smackover Racing
Gas Gas DE300
Team LAGNAF
www.smackovermotorsports.com
Once you're Over the Hill, You just pick up Speed!

 

i dont see anything on there that makes it better than ANYTHING, and
likely worse than straight distilled water..

it still requires biannual changes, like the "old" stuff
some isnt recommended for daily drivers (WTF?)
when it gets cold (-10 degrees), it GELS! just what i need- a radiator
full of jello!

sounds like a crock of crap to me, like scamsoil, royal purple, TRICK
racing gas, K&N, etc, etc.

might as well fill up quart milk jugs with piss and market it to squids
as a "all natural" coolant, for $10/ea.

maybe call it "royal trick yellow!"

ill stick with my prestone dexcool equivalent.

 

i can say the same about the prestone in the silver jug. change as
recommended every 2 years, no scale, never cloudy, looks the same coming
out as it did going in.

 

Well, I'd say it's really hard to tell whether it would be worse than
straight water or standard antifreeze, just as it would be hard to tell
whether it's better, outside of fairly well-defined environments.

Heck, under certain conditions diesel fuel and motor oil gel, that
doesn't make either product worthless. Similarly, straight water, while
having quite good thermal properties, is not the best choice for most
automotive cooling applications (because of a relatively low boiling
point, tendency to encourage corrosion, etc.).

The point of both of my posts in this thread is that there are
conditions under which something like NPG makes sense, conditions under
which plain water makes sense, and conditions under which standard
coolant makes sense. Before switching from standard coolant to something
else, one should know the answers to the following questions:
1) What conditions apply in my case?
2) What problem am I attempting to solve with this change?
3) How likely is this product to solve the problem?
4) What problems might this change cause?

Unless the OP can give a specific problem that they are trying to solve,
then I'd unhesitatingly recommend the stock (or equivalent) coolant.
Even if the OP can point to such a problem, my recommendation may not
change; that would depend strongly on particular circumstances.

--
Later,
John



'indiana' is a 'nolnn' and 'hoosier' is a 'solkk'. Indiana doesn't solkk.