Earliest four?

B-12 schreef:

Okay, I am not native English. So sometimes I write 'carter' instead
of 'sump'. And I write 'square cylinders' when I mean 'four
cylinders arranged in a square'. And some people start joking
about that. I don't care...
And I have an unabridged dictionary.

But what the *american beep" is 'to sell a pig in a poke'?
Rob.

 

it's a flea market for cars.
it's a british colloquialism.
sammm

--

 

You ought to sample a good clasic bike autojumble. At the one I went to,
aforementioned, there must have been 200-300 stands. Everything from
restored wartime Triumph TRWs, through DBD34 Goldies, to police spec
BMWs, kawasaki triples, Jap bikes of every persuasion, and spare parts
and accessories to boggle the imagination, new and used.

A good autojumble is heaven. Remember that we have rather a thriving
classic vehicle scene in the UK, aided and abetted by the most liberal
classic vehicle laws in Europe.

Which is nice.

 

Forgot to mention how nice it was to see an intelligent and interesting
discussion, an unusual breath of fresh air for this group!

 

While a "poke" is what a Brit wants when he'd like to shag a bird, a
"poke" was a leather pouch of other sturdy material where a California
goldrush miner put his nuggets back in 1849.

But, "pig in a poke" is English, not American. If you look in a
Tenniel-illustrated copy of "Alice in Wonderland", or "Through the
Looking Glass", you'll see piglets wearing pokes.

Americans would call a sunbonnet a "poke".

The closest Americanism to "pig in a poke" is "Let's put lipstick on
this pig and sell it".

 

Show me where I ever made such an assertion. While you're at it, show
me where I ever asserted that Scott oilers were no good or that single
plate clutches were inherently inferior to multi-plate clutches for all
uses.

Or, if you don't want to go through the bother of that, try channeling
up Hoyt M.and arguing about the benefits of carbon in a combustion
chamber.

Isn't it about time to head over to The Dog and Bone and hoist a pint?

 

I don't. The threads are there for people to read themselves. And you're
very, *very* good at twisting things. For instance, no, you never said
single plate clutches were inherently inferior. You said they were prone
to overheating, or some such - and I, and another poster, very gently
put you right.

Whereupon you promptly abandoned the thread.

And while I'm at it - your yammering away at the diaphragm carb guy, who
pointed out an oddity in his carbs, and to whom you gave a hard time.
Until it turned out that what he said could happen, could indeed happen.

You changed tack very quickly there. But without admitting that you were
wrong, nor giving him even the vestige of an apology.

People won't think worse of you if you fess up. Quite the oppositer.
They will think worse of you if you continue to behave as you are now.
In fact, it looks like they already are. Shame, considering you have so
much knowledge.

Or your assertion, a while back, that pegging a two-stroke power-vale
closed would cause the engine to overheat. (FY!, all Yamaha, and several
other makes, of small two-strokes, come to the UK with the PV pegged
shut by the factory - and no probs).

Screw up, fess up.

 

You shouldn't hold your breath, waiting for that to happen.

 

a poke is a sack. It's obsolete american slang, 18th or 19th century,
IIRC.

To sell a pig in a poke is to sell someone something sight-unseen (it's
inside the sack, after all). That way the unscrupulous seller can make
all sorts of claims about the object, but the buyer only gets to look
inside the 'poke' _after_ the sale.

--
Later,
John



'indiana' is a 'nolnn' and 'hoosier' is a 'solkk'. Indiana doesn't solkk.

 

Way, way earlier than that, ITYF.

<Googles>

Yup:

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/282900.html

http://www.idiomsite.com/piginapoke.htm

Yup.

 

No, I've noticed.

 

Heh. I could throw it all out of kilter by asking what was the first
water-cooled Jap four, because few people get that one right, and it's
one that I *do* know.

<Pause>

Anyone?

 

writes

Road bike?

er, GL1000?

Can't think of an earlier one off-hand.

 

Give the man a virtual coconut. It's amazing how many people say
"Kawasaki GPZ900R" which actually pioneered, er, nothing.

 

writes

Cor, I'm touched.

I just knew it was the 900R you had in mind when you said few people got
it right...
My first thought was VF1000 as the R variant was effectively obsoleted
by the 900R, then I remembered that the VF750 preceded that. Then I went
"duh" and thought leadwing...

So what was the first liquid cooled four stroke twin? CX?

 

And not even American either. lol My OED has 'poke' as deriving from
Middle English, which got it from Old Northern French, so the word is as
old as the language. I guess I should have looked it up before inserting
my foot in my mouth, eh? ;-)

--
Later,
John



'indiana' is a 'nolnn' and 'hoosier' is a 'solkk'. Indiana doesn't solkk.

 

Hm. Good point. LE Velocette pre-dated it by decades, but I bet there
was some obscure make that produced one before the LE,

 

I believe Scott had water cooled 30 years or so before this

The 1926 squirrel was, probably not the first though

http://www.antiquemotorcycle.org/TheClub/museum/ex_mus/TheBikes/1926 Scott/26 Scott.html

 

Scott was a two-stroke, though, wasn't it? Not a four-stroke.

 

Beg to differ; while "poke" may be British English for "sunbonnet,"
the "poke" of the "pig in a poke" phrase has the "pouch" or "sack"
meaning. The phrase "don't buy a pig in a poke" means not
to buy something without being able to inspect it. "Poke" has
also been used in this sense in the UK, although it generally went
out of common usage there before it did so in the U.S.. See:

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/282900.html

Bob M.