DUI under the limit

I have a question for the group. I ask it here because you folks are local
(ba) and I'm sure some of you have had some experience in this area
(unfortunately). The question is, if you get stopped by a LEO and he
breathylizes you, and you come out at, say, .03 ...which we all agree is
under the limit... is it policy to still take you to the slammer? I ask
this because I was told by my daughter (who went to Santa Rita for about 6
hrs) that even thoough she was stopped and incarcerated, she was under the
limit. Now, I wouldn't put it past her to bullshit me just to play the
innocent. OTOH, it wouldn't surprise me if the LE establishment does this
kinda crap just to get you in the system. So, what's the dealio? Do they
haul you in just for being under the influence?

nb

 

I believe there are 2 statutes,

One for driving under the influence

One for driving over the limit...

RicKB

 

That sounds close, because there can also be drugs involved ...and if the
officer thinks you may be a mixed drug and alcohol case and driving under
the influence they might haul you in.... particularly if they think you can
be caught and tagged for a few grand...they may do a urinalysis in the
slammer.


The other issue we will be seeing a lot, will be a gross increase in
ticketing as a way to fund city and state jobs especially in the police
depts by means of writing tickets for as much as possible (as was anounced
publicly by SF last year no less with a boost by 40,000 ticket/ mo
quota...and meter maids thicker than private vehicles.)...

In San Francisco they have helicopters up watching for people to slow down
in case they might park, then call in the meter maids for anyone slowing
near an empty parking space... 15 meter maids will have the guy cirlced
within seconds, so they can write him a ticket before he can get out and
feed the meter...

I have seen this dramatically in Marin county last year, then every one
started driving 5 miles under the limit ..and stopping totally dead at all
stop signs no matter what.. so ticketing revenue dried up on that basis.
Meantime in San Diego they were busy cutting yellow lights from 4 seconds to
2 seconds to trap drivers in camera traps (the city makes hundreds of
thousands of dollars a day at some intersections while creating rear end
collisions.... Martin Marrietta the aerospace giant has that as a
subsidieary, they install the camera's and do the adminiistration and take
60% of the collected revenues, if revenues are not enough they had been
cutting the yellow light time to as low as 2 seconds, that was also an issue
in Phoenix Az...before outraged citizens stormed city hall.)...

Accordingly I recommend timing yellow lights in your area...they usually run
3 to 4 seconds... the tactic will be to change them at random to 2 seconds
after they get equipped with camera's... $250 a ticket,, double that if
its three tickets in a year, and while doubling your car insuance..


Im looking now for other scams that will be run on drivers....probably
cyclically, we are relaxed again in Marin County and driving the speed limit
or over ... tickets and cops hiding in bushes will resume shortly... with
as many high dollar additives as they can tack on to each ticket such as no
seat belt, or reckless, or driving while hispanic, whatever they can...
lacking that these PD's and many city agencies will have no funds to keep
operations going and those fat ass , 90% of full pay retirements at current
levels.

(it takes all a few dozen home owners pay in propery and sales taxes a year
to support just ONE retired civil servant at 50 to 90k a year, .. amazin
aint it? Do the math. Its not complex.

<any PDm firemenm prison guards and school custodians are retiring at these
levels today..before age 50.,,,that was not the case 10 years ago... they
base the retirement solely on the last years income in many but not all
cases, and that gets inflated by other civil servants taking sick days,
putting the retiree into overtime a lot in his last year.) these people
will be sucking up the tax payer base at totally unstainable levels as they
live another 40 years...

except for one thing...we are running out of tax payers fast, as so many are
moving down into 15k a year jobs....no tax base there. so this mess will
starve itself to death at light speed...

Govt counter measures will be to devalue the dollar as it has since
2000...by about 35% correctly against other currencies in the world. that
has the effect of stealing a savers money ... our stock market is not up if
you figure this devaluation in..it is level from its low in this economic
crash...not up a dimes worth. George Bush bragged today that stock holders
value had gone up 3 trillion dollars since 2000... all bogus... the dollar
number *is up...but its a devalued dollar by 3 trillion you see.

and a recovery with no new jobs and more companies moving to china each
day...why? they cant afford to pay enough that employees can pay US taxes
and still sell product world wide...so most are forced to leave.

The govts next logical move is to inflate the currency domestically...that
will run up wages in the now current minmum wage brackets...to taxable
brackets...so people will be getting a higher dollar figure but less in
purchasing power while paying higher and higher taxes.

That is evidenced by the move to nationalize illegal aliens on terms that
turn them into income reporting (and heavily taxed citizens)...sounds good,
no? No it isnt good. They will then be getting $20 an hour instead of
$5 or $10.... all that is passed to the consumer.... prices go
up...inflation.... but more taxes for the govt... the govt survives as the
citizens get taxed beyond sustaninable levels.

thats where we are *now...in spades....we are headed to total
unsustainablility at warp speed. Taxing the mexicans will create only the
faintest short term blip...then less economic viability for all.....well
except the retired civil servants at 90k/yr they will be viable for a while
longer... when the last plumber is worked to death though... there will be
no more taxes to pay thier retirements.

sorry.





These people in federal state and local govt will be having brain storming
meetings about what to hit next etc..pedestrians jay walking etc... but the
citizens will spread the word fast and cut all that stuff out...so no
increase in revenue after the first few hundred jay walkers get tagged for
$200 each (half of them out of work or on minimum wage they cant pay
anyway)...


then will come increased fines and more meter maids for parking
tickets...until as in SF the public quits coming to SF... so the meter
income declines, then they double the parking fines and double them again
if you dont pay quickly enough... so now business is down, some buildings
are going empty and the sales tax and property tax suffers and there is no
money to fund govt.

So what to do? The city HAS to have the money...and its not going to lay
off those $120,000 once a month political appointee positions... thats how
they got elected...so what to do... ah yes...raise the bridge tolls again.
the Golden Gate is at $5 already. many of my customers in the city are in
deep trouble unable to hire employees already because low wage workers cant
afford an hours pay to cross the bridge or pay even more for bus tokens to
get to work...and no way in hell can they afford 2 grand for a mini apt in
SF. (property tax and fees for SF is already at $650,000 an acre of
developed property)... and we have wino's camped out in front of billion
dollar buildings in shopping cart tent cities... and no place to run them
off to.

We have taxed business to oblivion.


We have reached full saturation on how much the average person can pay in
taxes and fines... anymore just kills the tax base. Historically govt
learns that lesson only after the damage is done....the citizenry and
nations viability in the world suffers often terminally

(its a natural cycle, 520 years between peaks...we just peaked).



Currently govt is sized to leach a booming economy to death...and they were
doing well at it, the economy hung in there for the late 90's...but now with
manufacturing and even white collar legal, tax and management functions
going to india and russia... US income is set to tank like you cannot
concievably believe.... that will defund a bloated US govt.... currently
staying alive by borrowing.

Foreign investment has now dried up however...(its going to china)... no
more borrowng, and out of work citizens do not buy govt bonds.

The US is no longer a magnet for foreign capitol...so the borrowing is
history.

As the boomers retire and start drawing entitlements, and wages decline
because many $100,000 a year executives are now working as minimum wage
clerks (Channel 4 news for the last few days).... govt will have to downsize
by 70% at a minimum.

(the new meat dept guy at Safeway in my area is an ex high roller silicon
valley exec...his buddie an ex CFO is driving a cab now.)...those jobs will
last only if the economy doesnt get worse. An economy is supported by
its working people...those jobs are moving at the rate of tens of thosands a
month to china.

The cab and meat market business will slow down.

That loss of taxable income cuts even into the remaining civil service wage
rates as in all other countries that go down this path.... the civil
servants then live on what they can extort from the citizens as in Mexico
currently.

Then because of oppressive govt.... enterprise fails.... in fact its high
taxes that had driven US wage rates up so that US mfgr was no longer
competitve.

None of this is new in the faintest...its simply how history repeats itself.


There is one solution however: Cut govt by 70% (to levels we had just a few
decades ago, quite viable you see) including the bloated retirement
packages of recent years. That 70% will go to encourage enterprise, wages
can fall because of the vastly reduced taxes (including hidden taxes, the
rate is now between 60 and 70% on most people)... with lower wage costs US
industry will become competitive again and the nation will surive
economically because its products will become viable on the world market
again.

Currently we can't build a toaster for what it costs china to build a
computer...so they get all the business.


So brace yourself...



Phil Scott

 

Was there an open bottle in the car? That's also an offense. As is
reckless driving. If you're driving badly, not being drunk won't get
you off.

Al Moore
DoD 734

 

how old is this daughter? there's zero tolerance for anyone under 21.
any measurable BAC is an automatic license suspension and a DWI record.

what the law says is BAC > 0.08 is automatic DWI. < 0.08, its the
judgement of the arresting officer.

and, yes, if she was exhibiting intoxicated behavior, the actual BAC
doesn't matter.

 

she's over 21

Hah! Knowing my daughter and a cops zero tolerance of "tude", that might
explain it.

nb

 

Yep. I learned this at an early age and have been spared a lifetime of
grief. The minute you challenge a LEO's authority, (s)he will bust your
chops/face to prove who's in charge. It's basic sociology. Read the Naked
Ape by Desmond Morris, which has a brilliant section on how to deal with a
policeman. You don't have to kiss their ass. In fact, they hate that. It
will just make them more suspicious of you. Just be polite and show respect
for their authority. 13 out of 14 times, you'll drive away unscathed.

Perhaps this is a lesson I neglected to give my daughter.

nb

 

But it also indicates that under .04, the person is presumed to not be drunk.
It's the range in between where your behavior as observed by the officer
can get you convicted.

 

I once did a ride along with the Redwood City PD and we pulled over a guy
who readily admitted drinking 8 beers, but passed the FST's. When the
officer arrived with the breathalyzer he blew just below the limit and they
let him go with out even a ticket. The guy was polite, didnt give the cop
any grief at all, which helped him I'm sure.
Later, we pulled over another guy who lied "only a beer or two officer!" but
failed the FST's and blew a 1.2. He was arrested and put in what's called
"First Chance", which is not jail, but a more informal place with cots for
the busted to sleep it off. It is located in San Carlos, right by Nectar on
Industrial. Of course the faciltiy is locked down, but I would imagine much
more user friendly than the drunk tank. Cop said if you play it nice with
them during DUI's, you go there. If you resist or bad mouth etc, you go to
county for the night.

ac

 

No cop will EVER give a ticket to someone who has been drinking, but decided
not enough to go to jail. Imagine; the cop does the FST's and let's the guy
go with a "crossing over yellow line" ticket- only to crash into a school
bus full of kids a mile up the road. How'd you like to be the family's
attorney?

 

In San Francisco they have helicopters up watching for people to slow down

Dude, SFPD hasn't had a helicopter since the 70's.......

 

Yah. And Meter maids can't get ANYWHERE in the city in seconds. It'd be
minutes at least -- if you're going to use hyperbole, don't exagerate

 

seriously tanked does not sound like .12 to me. Reverse the numbers maybe.
Just a few years ago .10 was our standard, and the point at which I won't drive
is well short of the point I've been at and still been quite capable of moving
about.

 

but but...hyperbole IS exageration.

 

Ah, well, ya got me there

 

I picked up a friend from that place in San Carlos. He wasn't
driving, by the way, and he wasn't drunk (although he had consumed a
couple beers at home). He was walking back to his car, which was a
couple blocks away, broken down waiting for the tow truck.

So, he wasn't driving and wasn't drunk, but he was put in there
anyways because the officers (who were there because they found the
broken-down vehicle) smelled the beer on his breath.

Just thought I'd share.

 

Thanks for backing me up Jason. T

here are several different measurement units for blood level of ethanol, so
its easy to get confused (%, mg/ml. mgs/dl etc) but what I saw in the field
with the PAS unit was 0.12 for that guy.

aec
K12RS
FZ1

 

Ah-

I re read my post. Looks like I put 1.2 in the orig response-typing error.
At that level on the PAS, I believe you wouldnt be worried about getting a
DUI-you would have checked out long before...

aec

 

(same notbob as ba.food?)

The field breathalyzer unit readings for BAC are not admissible
as evidence in court -- that requires use of a calibrated unit,
which is located guess where?

They can insist on blood, breath or urine under penalty of
immediate suspension of your license. CHP usually don't
draw blood at the roadside, though they've been known to
perform wound ballistics testing on unruly folks. ;-)

 

guilty

nb