Downshifting during emergency stop

Is this frowned upon?

While doing an emergency stop (around 40mph) t'other day I noticed
that while I was coming to a halt when I pulled the clutch in I
instinctively dropped gears and then let the clutch out in 1st gear to
increase the decelleration. It's an ER-5 so rapid decelleration
doesn't come unless one throws an anchor off the back, so I must have
developed this downshift habit without knowing about it.

Is it an issue?

 

Not an issue at all imo - in fact it's a good habit as you'll be ready
to move out the way quickly if the car behind you isn't as quick on the
brakes as you were.

If you had to concentrate on doing it, it might be detremental to your
braking, but as it seems to be instinctive I don't see a problem.

 

BGN wrote

Down one, down one, down one, up one, down one, wheelie.


Perfectly normal.


It shows that you have half a clue on an instinctive level as to the
gear you should be in. Not a bad things as it happens.


--
steve auvache
750 VT Shadow (something for the weekend)
Bindit 600 (was lost and now is found)
GS500E (small but perfectly formed)
mongvan (dehydrated)

 

Get the bike stopped as quickly as you can while keeping it upright.
So long as you do this it doesn't matter.

Some might say you should be concentrating 100% on braking as hard as
possible without locking up, but if you spend more time thinking you
shouldn't be downshifting then it'll be counter-productive. Don't
worry about it and do the best you can.

 

As Steve and Krusty have already said, sounds like a good habit to get
into. I do it sometimes, depending on the situation. I haven't the
fainest idea if it's frowned on by the advanced rider types though.

 

Only if it causes the rear wheel to lock (it's braking effect drops off
enormously the second it locks) or the attention span used to change down
would have been better spent elsewhere (i.e. changing direction / looking or
escape routes / clocking the 6th-form eye-candy).

The front brake is infinitely more effective - so long as you don't lock it
up.

 

sorby wrote

Doesn't fucking matter if the back tyre is off the road. Which it tends
to be if you are braking for your very life.

--
steve auvache
750 VT Shadow (something for the weekend)
Bindit 600 (was lost and now is found)
GS500E (small but perfectly formed)
mongvan (dehydrated)

 

Ain't dat de fucking troof. Bang the front on *hard*, as early as you
can. Everything else is down to experience and practice.

Do the Coke can practice, Nick. Google for the method of you're not
familiar.

 

Sir wants a nice slipper clutch so Sir can just stamp down the box and
drop the clutch out when he feels ready.

 

I found one a few months ago by Bastard Bear, IIRC.

Method was something like:

1) Find quiet fast road
2) Find marker (sign, change in road surface, whatever)
3) Find coke can
4) Zoom down road to marker, throw out anchor
5) Place coke can at stopping point
6) Rinse, repeat and see how much one can knock off each time
6a) Have camera handy to document GORE if all goes wrong

An ER-5 with shit brakes is likely to be a good vehicle to do it with
as there's not *much* risk of doing a stoppie with my large frame on
it.

 

Please take note of "I instinctively dropped gears"

 

Beav wrote

Nah can't be, that is bollox that is. If it is not bollox then who was
the muppet who designed the test, she needs shooting for devotion to the
god of total knownothingness she does.




--
steve auvache
750 VT Shadow (something for the weekend)
Bindit 600 (was lost and now is found)
GS500E (small but perfectly formed)
mongvan (dehydrated)

 

That's SOP on the Kontinent Krusher. Front brake, rear brake, stomp rapidly
down the box, back tyre skipping around a bit. Every stop is an emergency
stop.

 

Not when I did it not so many years ago

--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 156 TS S2
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

 

There are better bikes available if you want to be certain [1] of not
doing a stoppie.

[1] No, that's *not* a challenge for anyone to take up.

 

Heh. For BGN, in an emergency, he wants the front brake on hard and
early, IMHO - but even before he does that, he needs to find out how
much he can give it, iyswim. The amount of trust one can build up in
one's brakes and the amount of grip from one's front tyre is
considerable, IME. Being aware of the behaviour of the bike,
suspension and tyre when under heavbraking in varying conditions is
dead fucking handy too - knowing what to expect is half the battle.

Once he's cracked that, then perhaps he might like to consider the
niceties of training himself to do it more effectively. Now, how did
it go?

Throttle shut, lean back hard, squeeze knees into tank firmly, give
the rear brake a good squeeze all in one swell foop.
Then get the front brake on as hard as poss. Reduce pressure on the
rear if locking becomes an issue.

Perform the above until it becomes instinctive and compare with
earlier Coke can runs. 10% shorter every time.

Working on simultaneously going down the box so as to enable avoidance
of a following but non-slowing vehicle under power is Module II, I
reckon, as IMVHO engine braking is neither desirable or of any value
in an emergency braking situation. Being in the right gear at the
right time once the braking period is over however, is.

You ought to give it a go - it may not be as effective to an old hand
on an R1 for example, but for those with less experience and/or
heavier bikes with lesser front brakes and more weight over the rear
to start with, it could be a boon. One thing's for sure: heavy front
braking is a lot easier to control and maintain when the rider's
weight is rearward to start with. The last thing non stoppie-gods
want is the rear lifting and having to ease the front brake off when
in an emergency situation.

Two things I found out about the new Speed Triple - the front lifts
very easily on the power in second - and the rear lifts very easily on
the front brakes. Not things I was expecting to find on a test ride
to be honest, but a right hoot all the same.

However: lifting the rear when braking from the ton, because a
non-looking numpty has pulled out on you is a little disconcerting.
It happened because I was unaccustomed to the bike and had no idea of
the power of the radial brakes; the weight distribution is well
forward; the rear brake effect is vestigial to say the least (as
confirmed by the showroom staff).

I got away with it because as numpty's front wheel moved I hit the
lever hard, albeit with two fingers. Because I was on it early, I had
space to ease the brake off and let the rear come down while
maintaining braking and the plot was back in order well in time.

Still made me think, though ... mainly about how many fingers I gave
numpty as I passed the dull fucker as soon as was practicable.

 

Why did you pull the clutch in? We taught people just to apply the brakes,
if you stall it didn't matter. When applying the brakes the front brake is
used almost exclusively and this will transfer the weight to the front wheel
(where you need it). A natural result of this is that the back wheel will
become light and any braking then done with the back wheel [1] will cause it
to lock up and skid.

[1] Engine or applying the brakes

 

I think that every time I see top-class trials riders.

I don't believe in physics every time they launch a 250(ish) bike at a
vertical surface and then ride up it.

I'm thinking of trading in the R1100S for an 1150GS so I can do it too.

 

You'd have to wear an Ewok suit. EU regs, apparently.

 

When I was doing my training (about 7 or 8 months ago now) we were
told that we should try to avoid stalling the bike during an emergency
stop, but as the bikes they used had hydrolic brakes it didn't matter
if we stalled it, although the DSA could give us a 'minor' for
gear/clutch control in this situation.

IIRC the DSA's Riding: The Essential Skills does mention that the
clutch should be pulled in before stopping. I'm not sure if there's a
time mentioned as I can't find the handbook, must be at work.

Everything else you've said in your paragraph does reflect what I was
trained to do. I was trained to shut off throttle, and squeeze the
front brake while just touching the rear for stability (in ideal
weather on ideal road) and pulling in the clutch just to avoid
stalling, then do a lifesaver each side and get out of the road,
sorting out the gears later.