[QUOTE="Ace"] These seem to be FOTM at the mo, but I've never been a believer in training beyond a fairly basic level. In my view, there's no substitute for mileage - get out there and ride, then keep riding until it starts to feel natural.[/QUOTE] Yeah, but you find the bad habits become more ingrained as you get faster and more confident. What the plod courses teach you (and i'm referring in my case to the Dave Corden experience) is good observation, good road positioning, and choosing the correct gear and revs. This is difficult to self teach, unless you have a lot of time on your hands. After finding I was in the correct position and in the right gear/rev range for cornering and overtaking, this made me smoother, and this led to more speed into and out of the manoeuvre. [QUOTE] you should find that your pace increases slightly, assuming you're not a spastic[1], and that your chicken strips will have reduced accordingly. [1] With all due respect to Ginge, AndrewR, etc.[/QUOTE] heh. Cheers, Paul.