Did anybody watch "The power of nightmares" on BBC2 last night, because nobody seems to have mentioned it? I'm always a little bit sceptical of any conspiracy uncovered programmes, but this one did make a very good case for Al Qaeda being an invention of the American government to allow them prosecute Bin Laden for the bombing of American embassies in Africa in 1998. Some of the stuff was, frankly, frighteningly paranoid especially the prosecution of 4 guys who were suspected of being an Al Qaeda sleeper cell in the US. The crucial bit of evidence was a video-tape they possessed of Disney Land, the prosecution argued that it had been made to scope out a terrorist attack - it looked like a tourist tape because that was it's cover and the fact that it did look like that proved that it was something more sinister. IMO "nightmares" wasn't a strong enough term for the title, they should have called it "The power of insane paranoid delusions". -- AndrewR, D.Bot (Celeritas) Kawasaki ZX-6R J1 BOTAFOT#2,ITJWTFO#6,UKRMRM#1/13a,MCT#1,DFV#2,SKoGA#0 (and KotL) BotToS#5,SBS#25,IbW#34, TEAR#3 (and KotL), DS#5, COSOC#9, KotTFSTR# The speccy Geordie twat.
I watched it. In fact I posted about it this morning. I commented that it wouldn't get shown on Fox networks. Being rumbled for deliberate fraud and the cynical abuse of human rights doesn't seem to ruffle the feathers of the NeoCons in the slightest. "Might is Right" I also saw an interesting program after that about a porn merchant getting indichted for selling porny vids online. It then went into some fairly revealing stuff about how the mid western pulpit is being used directly to recruit republican voters. "As soon as they're baptised we get them on the electoral register" Seperation of church and state? Abe Lincoln and Thomas Jefferson must be spinning at about 3000rpm.
AndrewR says... I missed that, but I did watch "The Porn King Vs The President" the other night. The evangelist "we're right, God is on our side" lot managed to make a rather dodgey porn baron seem like the epitome of sense and good reason... "If you're not with us, you're against us"
I guessed that you might have No gratuitous nudity for a start. When you have a president who seems to sincerly believe they have a mandate from god to clean up the world it makes seperation irrelevant I would have said. It also gives you the power to commit any attrocity you like in the name of the greater good. -- AndrewR, D.Bot (Celeritas) Kawasaki ZX-6R J1 BOTAFOT#2,ITJWTFO#6,UKRMRM#1/13a,MCT#1,DFV#2,SKoGA#0 (and KotL) BotToS#5,SBS#25,IbW#34, TEAR#3 (and KotL), DS#5, COSOC#9, KotTFSTR# The speccy Geordie twat.
Yep. It's millenialist shite wall to wall. "If they're dead they can't do bad things" This is the wierdness of the whole 'pre-emptive strike' mentality. I guess they think that if they show the world that they will cheerfully incarcerate without trial or bomb the **** out of anyone who they percieve as a potential future threat then everyone will STFU and toe their line. It's pretty much the same as the way Saddam kept control of Iraq. But then, he learned a lot of that from the yanks in the first place.
I've been thinking about this whole pre-emptive paradigm thing and what's worrying me is that I can't see a way to end it. If terrorist attacks still occur then it underlines the need for that kind of regime, if they don't then it proves that it is working. The evidence of its success is that there is no evidence that it is succeeding. Democracy can't work against it, because to be elected one must subscribe to it because to do otherwise can be shown that they have careless disregard for human life. I'm getting worried. -- AndrewR, D.Bot (Celeritas) Kawasaki ZX-6R J1 BOTAFOT#2,ITJWTFO#6,UKRMRM#1/13a,MCT#1,DFV#2,SKoGA#0 (and KotL) BotToS#5,SBS#25,IbW#34, TEAR#3 (and KotL), DS#5, COSOC#9, KotTFSTR# The speccy Geordie twat.
Thats just the start of it. How does someone defend themselves against an accusation that they are intending to do something which hasn't happened? Orwell called it thoughtcrime. He also had Airstrip one dropping doodlebugs on it's own cities to keep everyone afraid and compliant to the idea that a permanent state of martial law was necessary for the safety of society. The film 'Brazil' gets it perfectly.
AndrewR emerged from their own little world to say That was the point of the "Nightmares" documentary. Those who covet power want you to be worried, always. They don't care if it is the USSR or Bin Laden. There just has to be a monster to be slain. "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." (William Pitt, 1783)
And wasn't it superb; all three episodes comprised a fine piece of factual TV. I suppose there's a remote chance that PBS might take it. Frankly, BBC should just *give* it to them. The point was made somewhere recently [The Times, I think] that 40-odd years ago John Kennedy was at pains to insist that his religion was a personal matter and would have no bearing whatsoever upon his politicies. Now religion is necessarily the very corner-stone of every candidate's pitch. Yeurch!
"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else where I was capable of thinking for myself. Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free and moral agent." -Thomas Jefferson, letter to Francis Hopkinson, March 13, 1789
Oh goodie, a "1984" sub-thread. Orwell had his society waging a constant (and largely fictitious) war because he believed that it was necessary to destroy all of the products of labour in order to maintain a hierarchical society. He believed that if everybody had all of the home comforts they could need then they would not stand oppression, "In a world in which everyone worked short hours, had enough to eat, lived in a house with a bathroom and a refrigerator, and possessed a motor-car or even an aeroplane, the most important form of inequality would already have disappeared [...] It was possible, no doubt, to imagine a society in which wealth, in the sense of personal possessions and luxuries, should be evenly distributed, while power remained in the hands of a small privileged caste. But in practise such a society could not long remain stable. For if leisure and security were enjoyed by all alike, the great mass of human beings who are normally stupefied by poverty would become literate and learn to think for themselves; and when once they had done this, they would sooner or later realise that the privileged minority had no function, and they would sweep it away." So in Orwell's world the minority stage the war to destroy material goods and keep society poor and illiterate. It's one of the areas where I think he went wrong with his vision of the future. What we're seeing is that if material living standards are kept high then the ruling class can do whatever they like without opposition. If you're poor and hungry you can not hide from those facts; your hunger will cause you discomfort and your poverty will surround you. Sooner or later you'll have to do something about them. OTOH it doesn't hurt us if our freedoms are slowly taken away and the more material goods we have and the more we value them the less likely we become to risk their loss by rebelling against our masters. Revolutionaries of the past might have been willing to die for their cause, most people today won't risk their widescreen TV for theirs. -- AndrewR, D.Bot (Celeritas) Kawasaki ZX-6R J1 BOTAFOT#2,ITJWTFO#6,UKRMRM#1/13a,MCT#1,DFV#2,SKoGA#0 (and KotL) BotToS#5,SBS#25,IbW#34, TEAR#3 (and KotL), DS#5, COSOC#9, KotTFSTR# The speccy Geordie twat.
I guess I would value a Darsy Spec Home Entertainment System over freedom of speech, especially if it had one of those wireless keyboards.
Dunno, how much freedom do you want? -- AndrewR, D.Bot (Celeritas) Kawasaki ZX-6R J1 BOTAFOT#2,ITJWTFO#6,UKRMRM#1/13a,MCT#1,DFV#2,SKoGA#0 (and KotL) BotToS#5,SBS#25,IbW#34, TEAR#3 (and KotL), DS#5, COSOC#9, KotTFSTR# The speccy Geordie twat.
This was the more important point really. But the majority in our western societies *are* poor and illiterate. I don't mean poor in terms of personal ownership of the trappings of the western middle class such as widescreen TV's, but poor in terms of health, leisure, environment etc etc. Only until the downturn. Which Bush thinks he can get around with a 'just war'. True enough. Keep 'em busy with coupons and special offers, interest free credit transfers and celeb shenanigans, they'll never notice until they get the callup papers. "Just smart enough to understand the adverts, but not so smart that they start reading Marx."
<sucks teeth> Sorry mate, we're all out, but we can do you a 28" plasma screen if you'll forfeit the right to trial by jury. -- AndrewR, D.Bot (Celeritas) Kawasaki ZX-6R J1 BOTAFOT#2,ITJWTFO#6,UKRMRM#1/13a,MCT#1,DFV#2,SKoGA#0 (and KotL) BotToS#5,SBS#25,IbW#34, TEAR#3 (and KotL), DS#5, COSOC#9, KotTFSTR# The speccy Geordie twat.
