Any future in air-cooled?

I was just wondering, looking at that new Honda 1100cc thing, that's
air-cooled, due to some rather clever ducting between the barrels...

I mean, the Japanese have been building four-stroke fours for nearly 35
years now, and with modern pollution (noise, exhaust) I thought
watercooled was here to stay.

But I suppose if you're not after ultimate power, air-cooled may still
have a future. After all, more power = more noise, so a softly tuned
bike...

Thoughts, anyone?

 

Nikasil barrels seem to be pretty bulletproof with better heat
transfer characteristics. Couple those with higher quality
synthetic oil and air/oil cooled engines might be around
a while longer.

I've always figured hp/lb. with a broad power band was
more interesting than hp/liter anyway.

 

See Mark Olson''s post.

Agreed, but I also think these new Hondas will show that air-cooled can
be done, if ultimate performance is not the aim. And obviously they look
great on retro bikes.

Disagree here. To an extent. You'll see engines being spread across a
number of designs, but that's nothing new. Think what Kawasaki did with
the original Z650 lump, for example.

Agreed, but there may be exceptions.

The 11050 Beemer engine isn't that old. The Harley is a certified museum
piece, and one reason why it passes noise and emission tests is that it
develops sod-all power for a thing that big.

Heh. I've just passed my Honda CD250U to my teenage son. Same engine.

 

http://motorcycles.about.com/od/conceptbikegalleries/ig/2007-Tokyo-Motor
-Show-Hondas/index.htm

The R version looks gorgeous.

 

Don't Panic!
No cause for concern.....in any normal situation, that is.
The engine doesn't make "much" heat at idle.
You still get some cooling from simple convection.
All the mass of the engine, oil, tranny, etc. will "sink" the heat for a
while and the give it up when moving.
Having said that, I still turn mine off if stopped for a LONG train, etc.

 

Good question. What you will get is more localised hotspots, without a
circulating coolant to even things out. But thenthere areplenty of air-
cooled engines that are designed to run indefinitely without moving.
Think small power generators. I suppose it depends on whether they're
super-powerful or not. I do know that some aircraft turbofans can't be
run at full throttle on the ground for more than a few seconds or they
overheat and go pop.

Counterbalanced by the need not to add acres of heavy cylinder
finning, though. And the water jackets themselves are (obviously!)
hollow, so light.

I'm amazed by how far the Japs have come with their watercooled fours,
since the mid-1970s. Not just in terms of power, but also reduced
weight. Mind you, that applies to just about every aspect of Jap bike
technology.

 

Ah yes, but they have FANS.....often integrated with the flywheel.
Except for a tiny few, air cooled bikes are missing fans.

 

Ah, yes, that's true. Still, as you say, the engine doesn't make much
heat at idle and the rest of the mass will soak it up. A hell of a lot
of scooters are still fan-cooled, I think. Not really my area of
interest.

Actually, and here's a little interesting question (x-posted to
reeky).

What was the first Japanese water-cooled four cylinder four-stroke
motorcycle?

 

In mass production, iirc, the 1984 Kawasaki GPZ900, in the U.S. known
as the Ninja 900.

 

Nah, previous decade, different factory & different engine layout.

GL1000?

Has there been a Japanese water-cooled four stroke triple? I can think
of singles, twins, 4s & 6s but not a triple...

 

The only water-cooled triple I can think of is the BMW K75 series.

Citizens look at my K75S and ask, "What kind of motor is that??"

I reply, "It is a three cylinder, fuel injected, inline longitudinal
motor, laying on its side with all the pistons pointin' to the left."

Or sometimes, due to its unusual whine, "It's a turbine!"

 

Argh! And I even *HAD* a second-year (1976) example! Of course, my
blind spot was blithely thinking ONLY of inline fours!

 

[]

Triumph have been, since '91 or so, making water cooled triples in a
variety of capacities (675, 750, 900 & 1050). Benelli make one as well
but I'm toiling to think of any others - Laverda had a prototype &
Aprilia raced one in MotoGP but neither made it into production.

Actually, I'm quite surprised that the Italians, Brits & Germans have
all made them but not the Japanese. I mean, Honda seem to have made
every configuration of engine imaginable except for the 4 stroke
triple...

 

I wonder is there a bike that handles worse than that cow?
vfr750 that came just two years later was light years ahead
in all departments.

 

Triumph Trident 900 (from the 90's not the 70's)
various Benellis - Tre, TNT, etc

 

Key words: "I can think of..." <g>
and just because there is one in the garage.
(desperately waiting for the snow to stop - it's coming down heavily)

 

I think you're thinking of the early to mid seventies TWO STROKE Suzuki
Water Buffalo triple cylinder. Like someone after you said only the the
Europeans made water cooled triples but not until the 90's (Triumph, BMW &
maybe some exotics, like Bennelli) The Goldwing boxer four in the mid to
late seventies was the 1st Japanese 4 stroke bike with liquid cooling. Then
nothing until the 900 Ninja & RZ-350/500=(two stokes) in 84 like Tim
quoted. BTW, Tim had an RZ-350 too.

 

Wrong!

 

Right!

 

It handled well enough to clean up in the TT in 1984.

A better all-round bike, but not really that much a better handler.