Another bike down - "I didn't see him"

Rubbish. Particularly where I live in NQ. White cars everywhere, few black,
white houses, signs, glare galore, all black stands out. This is not Sweden.

I also researched the subject. That was back when compulsory lights-on was
first being pushed on us. I came to the opposite conclusion to you.

The dangers, legal issues, maintenance issues were enough that thousands of
us pushed the case to ministers and shadow ministers both state and federal
and shortly after the election of the Howard Government, ADR19/01 was
scrapped.

In 1998 the first thing I bought for my new Triumph was a light switch. I
ride with my lights off.

It's all black. All of my bikes are black. Apart from two blue ones and one
brown one but I painted them black too. Except for one of the blue ones.
Bastard got away from me...

People have no trouble seeing me. I wear a black helmet. Or sometimes the
other black helmet. I have a black jacket but mostly I wear a black t-shirt.
My boots are black.

I tried black jeans but it's not a good look. Blue jeans will have to do.
Getting hard to get the really dark ones though, have to go to saddlery
shops these days...

I have found some people, sometimes, are unaware of my presence. Oddly
enough, it happens mostly when driving the work truck. Big red one. Flashing
lights. Strobes. Sirens set to Phaser. No response from Woodduck. Honk horn.
Woodduck pulls over. There's a reason they don't give us guns...

The Harley was even better. People used to pull over to let me pass
sometimes, no doubt worried that I might take out their rear window with the
shottie we all carry strapped to the forks.

They'd often pull up 2 or 3 car lengths behind me at the lights. Couldn't
take the risk of getting shunted into me from behind, could they? That
shottie thing again probably...

What it comes down to, my paternally-challenged friend, is that it's your
level on the Woodduck's personal scale of threat to life and limb that
determines what happens next.

I'm riding a loaner KLR650 in bright green with hardwired lights at the
moment. Can't say I feel any safer...

 

I can tell you for a fact that in certain conditions that a bike is NOT
visible
in daylight conditions.

I was travailing through a town as 2 bikes were coming the other direction.
(I only knew that they were there when they were right on top of me).
The reason that they could not be seen was that the sun was right behind
them. There lights were on. There lights eliminated there shadows so that
they could not be seen. If I need to turn right I would have wiped them out.

I have owned many bikes and travelled many hundreds of thousands of K's
and only one bike has had lights on (my current bike) I have had more near
misses on that bike than any other (and only because I have been able to
avoid them). And I know a few people that cars have deliberately tried to
run into. so don't say no one does as I am one of them and it was by a 60+
year old retiree. it happens.

Smiley

 

So how many people did you talk to in you research paper? or did you just
read it from someone else's paper? what was their method? how many were
the car drivers fault? how many counter augments did you read? have you read
any of the research papers that come to a different conclusion? (there are
always
counter augments. if you had done any research you would know this). are any
of the research papers that you read done by riders? or is it just your
opinion?

Smiley.

 

I think I left them in the back of the Tarago...

(I don't care what people say, shooting fish in a barrel is still fun!)

big

 

"Shane" wrote

If you can't see a motorcycle you need to give back your licence.

Theo

 

"Shane" wrote

<Shane putting his head back in the sand.>

Theo

 

Which you've, then, true to the pattern you haven't deviated from over
the half decade I've been aware of your pointless existence, neatly
sidestepped in favour of bootstrap belittling, as evidenced below...

I reiterate, in simpler terms so even a (former?) highway patrolman can
understand it...

....how can you defend biased research?

 

"Shane" wrote

Or we were unlucky?

Theo

 

If that's the case, they can well go and hang out on aus.bicycle.

"Cycle business"?
"Ride enthusiasts"?

What have you, got Sheriff John Bunnell's "1001 Handy Phrases for
Undercover Work" open on the "Infiltrating Biker Scum" chapter?

 

Fight your own battles, you chickenshit ****.

Atta boy, Shane. Keep building those bridges...

 

The problem is, is "standing out amongst a large amount of traffic" of
any use to a motorcyclist (in terms on increasing out safety)?

Nobody pulls out in front of me bike when I'm "in amongst a large amount
of traffic", they pull out in front of me when I'm the only thing on the
road. "Standing out" in traffic is not a concern for me.

So lets talk about being seen when I'm _not_ in traffic.

Its obvious that at a 1 or 2km distance, a bike with its headlight on is
easier to see than one without its headlight on. Which is of no
practical benefit at all to me on my bike, because if I've got a 1km
buffer zone, then I don't care whether that car has seem me or not, he
can't get me even if he tries (which, as you point out, he's
spectacularly unlikely to do).

I'm much more concerned about cars seeing me at the range of 100 or 200
meters. At that sort of range (in commuting conditions/speeds) I've
still got 5 or 10 seconds to stop or manouvre to avoid a dopey car
driver, and if he can't see me at a couple of hundred meters its got
nothing to do with whether I've got my headlight on or not, its simply
because he didn't bother looking. Sure, they'll use "you didn't have
your headlight on" as an excuse, but if they "didn't see" a motorcycle,
then why would they expect to see a pedestrian or a cyclist or a road
worker? If they don't look, they wont see. Not everything they _need_ to
see is going to have a headlight, and as Dale points out, they'll
perfectly happily _claim_ they looked and that its not their fault
because your headlight wasn't on _even if it was!_ They'll say that to
people who's bike doesn't let them turn the headlight off!

The reason _I_ choose to not ride with my headlight on all the time is
because I know that for me, its significantly harder at certain times of
day to judge the distance and speed of a single headlight. Particularly
around dawn and dusk, I find it _much_ easier to accurately judge the
distance and speed of a motorcycle without its headlight on that one
with its headlight on. Sure, I'll notice a bike from much further away
with a light on, but its more important to be able to tell whether that
bike 200m away is doing 60kmh or 100kmh, and I find that easier to judge
without a headlight. I can only assume that my eyes and brain are wired
similarly to the rest of the population, and that this same factor works
on other people.

big

 

The Perth study was done by the MRAWA over several years pre-law and showed
that the 75% of bikers who rode with their lights on before the legislation,
were having 85% of the accidents resulting in hospitalisation. If you look
at it from the opposite view, the 25% who didn't have their lights on had
only 15% of the accidents.

Hard to argue with that.

Theo

 

If you knew anything about academia you would know that they are generally
the least qualified to do this sort of thing.

When you have people who are qualified to analyse these things and

Cant challenge the models as you haven't posted them. what were the
questions
asked in these reports? or are they just statistics? have any been done in
aus that
you have read? who funded these reports? were there agendas to appease?

Smiley

 

Nice statment for say "after getting rid of the figers i don't want" the
result are.

Smiley

drivers wearing any reflective or

 

About fucking time! If you don't want to argue with him, then _don't!_

big (who thinks more people should use killfiles more often...)

 

It has nothing to do with being picked on.
when are YOU gonna come down for a drink or a rally like most of the
people in here.
You should be aware this is also a social group not just a discussion group.
IK is known personally by most of the people in here whereas you are
just a voice in the ether.
Instead of being anatagonistic come for a ride, meet up with the people
here.
We are not aus.cars where most people in there are dickheads.
If you don't take up the offer then you have nop right to say what you
have about members in here because we know each other personally.

 

*plonk*

Postman Pat

 

I was under the impression that about half of all motorcycle crashes were
single vehicle accidents, no car involved.

Theo

 

Treat the symptoms not the cause. Bike riders will die because of this
attitude.
start charging drives at fault with manslaughter and see how many drivers
then start looking instead of glancing (there is a differance between
"looking"
and glancing).

Smiley.

 

So what academic studys have you done?

But this is what you do. "This reoport says this" same as saying "Errr, what
he said"

Didn't answer the question


Smiley