And so it begins...

Not bad. One of my cats gets wierded out by bangs and loud noise and
the other doesn't. It's tough shit for the cat, but there you are.

If I continued with this line if reasoning, I'd not have parties or
gatherings of any sort chez prawn in case one of the cats got upset.
They just have to put up with things that wig them out from time to time
and that's the end of the matter,

On balance their lives are incredibly stress free in comparison to their
wild cousins.

 

I'd like to oblige but I don't have time today: gotta go to Portsmouth in a
few minutes.

Blaney is good on the topic too. He should be awake now....

 

Shtop right there - who says that any of my dogs 'exist entirely for my
benefit'? It's a *symbiotic* relationship - I get the enjoyment of
their company and they get regular food, regular exercise and being
part of a pack (which dogs a genetically programmed to enjoy - a dog on
it's own is usually a pretty miserable dog).
They also live a lot longer than their wild counterparts - and don't
suffer for malnutrition, disease and injury like their wild
counterparts either. Both sides benefit - hence a symbiotic
relationship.

Lets deal with it in order shall we:

I decide what they eat: Yes - guilty as charged. Which is why they
don't starve to death or die from eating stuff that will kill them (as
happens in the wild). They also don't need to spend all day foraging
for food. I don't see my role in this as in any way disadvantaging the
dogs or even going againstt their natural inclinations.

When it eats: Again - guilty as charged. Again - we feed our dogs twice
a day. As with the previous point I don't see how this is bad either.
In the wild they would spend a large portion of their day scavenging
and hunting so it would be impossible for them to have a feeding
schedule but I fail to see how having a schedule is somehow bad for
them.

Where it goes: Well - yes again - guilt as charged. Again - how is this
bad for the dog?

And in the wild pretty much all of their existance is equally out of
their control - if a bigger dog comes along and makes itself pack
leader then that dog can determine much of how its pack members live -
to the extent of controlling who can breed.

THEY ARE NOT HUMAN BEINGS! Not even an juvenile one so it's a bit odd
that you compare their behaviour or the relationship to that between
humans - you are in fact falling into the same trap as people who get a
dog as a child-substitute. They are not human, don't look for the same
things out of the relationship that a human would and don't respond to
the relationship as a human would. Any more than a dog will respond in
the same way that a cat would (try treating a cat as if it were a dog
and it would very quickly move elsewhere!).

I really do despise people who do treat pets like they were humans -
they are not and shouldn't be treated as such. They are animals that
are programmed by genetics to behave in certain ways (live in packs,
scavenge/hunt food, hump anything that moves and is in season etc etc).

Most of the problems people have with dogs are where they treat dogs as
either people or toys - they are neither and treating them as one just
confuses the hell out of the dog. We can adjust our programming to a
certain extent (and I'm not talking about superficial behaviour but
instincts here) because we can rationalise our actions - but dogs (and
cats) can't. So when one of their instincts is triggered they respond
to that trigger in the way that they are programmed to - and expect the
person that triggered the behaviour to respond appropriately too.

Phil.

 

I was rather impressed by the one in Hastings last week. I've seen a
fair few firework displays in my time, but not a continual onslaught of
explosions like that. The second one (over the hospital closure protest
thing) was nigh-on daylight.

 

I was having a pint with one of the Bonfire Boys on Tuesday evening. It
was 'disappointing' apparently.

" "

 

The gauntlet has been well and truly thrown. When's the Rye bonfire
again? I'll drag the mrs down, and don't forget your bloody phone this
time.

 

November 11th. I think they close the A259 from 6 pm till err late - so
come early ish.

To be fair, I *think* that he was referring to the parade turnout and
not the pyrotechnics.

 

Uh huh

See this is where I loose you

 

Any fuss at all is taken by the dog as cue to make a fuss too. If the
owner just sits and ignores the fireworks the dog might [1] too.

[1] I say 'might', but it depends on the growler. Mine does, but when I
first got him, fireworks made him a bit nervous - now he doesn't give a
shit about them.

 

<whistles, applauds, stamps feet>

I say, well done. Luckily, round here, there's only an occasional one -
nothing like in the towns. If I had to share space with some of the
mouth-breathing cunts that let fireworks off in the late evening/early
morning, I'd probably go postal.

 

Actually they wouldn't - our neighbours would come and feed them. As
would my brother.

However - there is a *huge* difference between 'are dependant on me'
and 'exist entirely for my benefit'. I agree that they are dependant on
me - but then a pre-school child would be too (if I had any).

Companionship. Exercise (taking them for walks et. al.). A (semi)
sentient burglar alarm. Enjoyment from watching them organise their
pack heirarchy. Vet bills :-(
And before you mention it the companionship is a very different order
and type to that that I derive from the humans around me.

Another invalid assumption on your part - it's not utterly one-sided.
They benefit, I benefit. They get a pack leader that provides for them
what a pack-leader in the wild would (leadership, food, opportunity to
hunt (except we call it walks and there is no actual hunting involved),
and a place to sleep safely) and I get enjoyment from their company and
the other things I mentioned above.

Phil.

 

Hang on a minute. Aren't you "christians" supposed to love everyone? I
don't think your bible allows you to despise anyone.

--

Paul.
CBR1100XX SuperBlackbird
BOTAFOT #4
BOTAFOF #30
MRO #24
OMF #15
UKRMMA #30

 

Get thee hence to the vet, and get a DAP diffuser. You plug it in and it
releases a pheromone that chills the dog out. You need to be using it for a
couple of weeks to get the full effect though, so getting one ASAP would be
a good idea. You can also get it in a spray which you can apply to their
bedding too.

As others have said, the absolute best thing you can do is not fuss or
comfort the dog. All that does is reinforce the fact that something is wrong
and/or frightening. Just give them somewhere to hide if they want to and
ignore them.

If anyone has cats that are frightened, the same applies but get a "Feliway"
diffuser, which mongs your cats out. You can use the cat and dog ones in the
same house with no ill effects.

This post brought to you courtesy of wife with 15 years as a veterinary
nurse, jacking it all in tomorrow

 

Just like UKRM, then?

 

In uk.rec.motorcycles, SteveH belched forth and ejected the following:

Who here hunts food in the traditional sense?

Gotta be a lurker.

 

I hope you throw up after scoffing that stinking pile of dog shit
loosely used as bait.

 

I dunno; up there ^^ he's been chomping away happily on all sorts of
mouldy old stuff. Time was he needed a bit more to get going.

--
_______
..'_/_|_\_'. Ace (brucedotrogers a.t rochedotcom)
\`\ | /`/ GSX-R1000K3 (slightly broken, currently missing)
`\\ | //' BOTAFOT#3, SbS#2, UKRMMA#13, DFV#8, SKA#2, IBB#10
`\|/`
`

 

You're a lesbian?