400-4 starting problems.

Yep.[/QUOTE]

Ta.

 

On Tue, 27 Apr 2004 17:39:07 +0100,

See, there's a problem with that. I've always maintained that fuel
can't 'go off' or become stale, so if I go down this road (which seems
the logical choice) I'll have to come up with some new way of
explaining what happens...

 

I've always wondered about that too. Most years my bike has just
been left in the garage over winter. Not 'laid up' but neglected,
no TLC. Nothing.
Come spring, I'll charge the battery up and try running the bike.
I've generally not had a problem with the bike starting on the
'old' fuel that could have been in the tank for up to five months.

Of course, I can only vouch that this seems to work OK for Kawasakis.

 

Well given that petrol, by it's nature, is a volatile chemical, clearly
some change is possible given the right time and conditions.

Your problem is likely to be a combination of things.

 

Petrol is a mixtures of a multitude of hydrocarbons, some of which are more
volatile than others - the more volatile ones, I assume, will slowly
evporate off and leave the less volatile ones behind.

 

Ace posted ...

A volatile liquid, petrol, which royally screws carbs up, probably due to
evaporation of some of the constituent parts leaving 'debris' behind, can
easily be simply not volatile enough to start a cold engine after only a few
months ... depending on conditions.

I'd also have a look at all the carb rubbers to see that there's no air
entering. The rubbers can easily split over time ... assuming 400/4's have
carb rubbers .. both between carbs / engine and carbs / airbox ..

 

That's the theory, but my sister-in-law, who's an industrial chemist,
assures me that this is in fact not the case, hence my stance on the
subject.

The thory that evaporation in the carbs themselves might have left som
'junk' behind is much more likely, IMO.

In any event, I'll test it out when I get a chance (like, two weeks
time when I get back from Canada) by draining and cleaning out the
carbs and filling with fresh fuel, then assuming I get it running,
drain them again, refit the tank of old fuel and trying with that. If
(after leaving it for a day to ccol down, obviously) it starts on the
new fuel but not the old then I'll have to admit defeat.

I'll let y'all know either way.

 

Petrol deteriorates it leaves an awful smelling gum behind I have had the
prob a few times when fuel has been left in a stored biked fuel system.

erasms

 

"> >Petrol is a mixtures of a multitude of hydrocarbons, some of which are
more

Experience tells me your sister, chemist or no is incorrect it does
evaporate and leave a gummy substance behind this is after quite a long
time.
erasnotachemistims

 

If it smells like gloss paint it's not good.

 

If you read carefully you'll see that I'm not discounting that. The
idea that a full tank of petrol will have simply lost its volatility
is what I maintain can't happen.

 

Ace wrote

 

Ace says...

Adie's bandit had been sitting for over 6 months with a 3/4 full fuel
tank. Being a tight bastard, and working to a budget, I dcided to try
and start it and do whatever checks with the fuel it has. It took some
getting going because oil had seeped past the rings when the engine was
sat tipped forward for a week, but it starts and runs now on that same
fuel.

My old RD250D was once left for 18 months with fuel in the tank. It
started second kick and I ran it on that petrol until it needed filling.

 

When I lived in South Africa a lot of the petrol out there was produced from
coal (SASOIL) and I think had a certain amount of either ethanol or methanol
added ( I can't remember which) and with certain cars, problems occurred in
the carbs if the petrol was old. I believe it left a build up of a jelly
like substance in the carbs. This was in the eighties. The first time I saw
'Fresh Fuel For Sale' at a garage I laughed.

Probably doesn't help with starting a 400/4 though, although being in
different hemisphere the fuel probably spirals down the fuel pipe in the
other direction

Brian

 

Snowy's Z200 had been in the back of her garage for about 18 munce, it
needed a new battery but the fuel still worked.

 

Not in a full tank of fuel, no - but the small amount in carbs, a most
definite yes.

 

You didn't sniff the fuel I drained out of the Z200 carb this weekend.

It smelled, not of fuel, but varnish.

The problem has got worse since the introduction of unleaded fuel, which
has that many more additives. The volatiles evaporate, leaving an unholy
gunge.

I agree, three months, six months maybe, is OK - anything more is
trouble.

 

"> >

It tends to gum up jets etc .
ersm

 

Yes that's the smell Gloss paint of Varnish.
ersms

 

My Daytona 900 was OK with 3-year-old fuel. I think it's a load of old
bollocks.